| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! 15:27 - Nov 3 with 20245 views | NOTRAC |
Although the 2014 accounts have not been published and submitted to Companies House in respect of Swansea City AFC ,the Trust has just published their 2014 accounts on their new website.
From these one thing stands out.The Trust has received a further dividend for the 2014 year of £210,000 which means that a total dividend of £1m has been declared and paid to all the shareholders.
This means that for each £100,000 originally invested by each shareholder they have now received a Return of £300,000, that is, three times their original investments.
If it is true that they are also looking to sell their shares to the American investors there is only one thing that can be said about them
They are greedy bastards who are no different to Mr Petty, the man they once decried.
Surely they should now do a Mel Nurse, and gift their shares back to the club, and prove that they are men of integrity and not the crap that they appear to be turning into. |  |
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| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:18 - Nov 3 with 1675 views | _ |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 16:23 - Nov 3 by Fag_Ash_Will |
After the risk they took all those years ago, I'd be looking to cream off more than they have had over the last couple of years if I were in their shoes.
I don't begrudge them a penny. |
So which one of them are you then? Come on... spill the beans. |  |
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| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:19 - Nov 3 with 1672 views | Dewi1jack |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 17:50 - Nov 3 by Shaky |
Whatever. |
That's quite a patronising reply.
As Lisa states (and is in the public domain) the PR campaign began, prior to the Trust issuing their statement, with "somebody" inferring the Trust were not acting in the best interests of Swansea City AFC
When what they meant was the Trust were creating problems in that/ those "somebody/ ies" selling their shares for a nice little profit.
It would have been better if the somebodies had been honest in their reasons for selling up. No proper Swans fan would have begrudged them taking care of their family. There was no need for them to cast aspersions on any one elses integrity.
If you're able to help the Trust with advice, couldn't you be the bigger man, send the Trust committee your credentials for being able to inform/ advise and offer your help/ knowledge?
You may just mention something that their own advisors have missed. You may not.
At least the Trust will be reasonably sure they have covered most of the likely outcomes, working on the principle that no plan survives first contact.
I seem to remember someone (Uxbridge I think) willing to act as proxy on your behalf, if you and Phil really can't work together |  |
| If you wake up breathing, thats a good start to your day and you'll make many thousands of people envious. |
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| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:22 - Nov 3 with 1662 views | Davillin |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:10 - Nov 3 by Fuggie |
I don't think they have one. I might apply but would not be any good.
Either way all I am suggesting is wait until an actual offer is made not speculate about what will (rather than might) happen |
A very sound position, indeed.
However, I think most of the posters on here are hoping to influence outcomes -- on any one of three "boards" -- a worthy hope, in my opinion.
One of the reasons I have been a Swansea City supporter for so long is because the supporters have fully demonstrated time and time again that they will not roll over and whimperingly beg to be ploughed under, but will stand up and fight -- with considerable enthusiasm and intent -- for their club. |  |
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| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:29 - Nov 3 with 1642 views | _ |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 17:58 - Nov 3 by NeathJack |
I think I may be on my own here but I don't think any dividends should be getting paid out and no shareholders should be profiting from the sale of any shares.
They are custodians of the club on behalf of the fans and should not be making any money off the back of it, regardless of how successful they've been.
That's not why they got into it and that shouldn't be what they do now. |
Wow Paul... I can't believe I'd ever read a post like that from you... bravo son. | |
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| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:33 - Nov 3 with 1634 views | _ |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:05 - Nov 3 by Fuggie |
This is the problem. A professional football club is a business these days. Back in the 80's when Sky was not around I agree owners were thought of as custodians, though there were a few who tried to make a profit. These days with all the large revenue flowing into a Premier league club they are actually investors.
I agree with your assessment that the Swans investors did it for the love of the club but I think they should be rewarded for the risks they took with their own money. Just to return £100,000 with a thank you card would be pushing it after 12 years. [Post edited 3 Nov 2014 18:06]
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Whoa back don't get carried away with all that crap.
Everything is relative and trust me, they were "investors" back then with perhaps, perhaps the exception of Martin Morgan. They were all very pally with Doug Sharpe around that time and Doug wouldn't have done too bad from SCFC even during "those days" | |
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| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:35 - Nov 3 with 1630 views | Fuggie |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:22 - Nov 3 by Davillin |
A very sound position, indeed.
However, I think most of the posters on here are hoping to influence outcomes -- on any one of three "boards" -- a worthy hope, in my opinion.
One of the reasons I have been a Swansea City supporter for so long is because the supporters have fully demonstrated time and time again that they will not roll over and whimperingly beg to be ploughed under, but will stand up and fight -- with considerable enthusiasm and intent -- for their club. |
Agree with the supporters philosophy, especially dealing with past owners ,however these are swans fans who took over the club, at great risk to themselves in most cases. I do not see an issue with them being reward for the risk they took.
If I join this speculation how about this solution;
Assuming 50% of shares are made available for sale the holders sells 75% their holding to the new investor and the remainder is gifted to the trust. This would probably benefit nearly all parties as the Trust share holding increases without any expenditure. Not sure of the tax consequence of the gifting of shares on the original 50% holders but I am sure the sales proceeds would be more than adequate..
New shareholding [I Think]: 37.5% New Investor, 33.5% Trust & 19% Old Investors [Post edited 3 Nov 2014 18:37]
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| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:37 - Nov 3 with 1624 views | Uxbridge |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 17:55 - Nov 3 by Fuggie |
I thought the rumour was 30-40% holding being sold to an unnamed investor (probably US)? This could mean 1 or 2 investors fully selling up or a split a dilution of all investors holdings (except the trust).
Either way I cannot believe how much moaning there is about this club at present. First of all we have moaners saying we are not investing enough on players and that the stadium (that we do not own) should be increased immediately to 30,000+ or even build a new stadium.
Now when there is the possibility of investment coming into the club, the local individuals who took an extremely high risk 12 years ago are being criticised for selling their shares at a profit. Despite no formal offer being made.
May I remind people that 12 years ago the club was on it's ar$e. No matter how much love you had for the club investing £100,000 (10%) back then was extremely high risk. I doubt any of the investors expected to received their money back let a lone a return.
Despite the sorry state the club was in these individuals helped the club ensure its financial position is as secure as it is today despite the possible detriment to their own finances. Yes I expect some of them had contracts with the club but I cannot remember there being an outcry due to profiteering. With the amount of leaks in our club we would have heard something by now.
Are we now saying that these people will go back against their own ethics/ethos?
Some investors maybe thinking of selling up. Well if they do so be it . Maybe they intend to gift some of the shares to the Trust when this happens. Who knows. There are a lot of assumptions based on the glass half empty scenarios and everyone knows "Assumption is the mother of all f... ups".
The speculation is becoming ridiculous and to a certain extent farcical.
What will be will be. |
I prefer a more proactive approach personally but there we are.
Nobody's mentioned actual investment in the club though. A sale of shares isn't investment in the club.
Regarding contracts with the club, personally I've not got any problem with contracts being awarded to shareholders so long as the process if all above board. I gather that was the case regarding Landore, so no problems there. However it's not an issue of leaks or not ... this is all documented in the last set of accounts.
We agree in that nothing is set in stone yet. If the shareholders act in the best interests of this football club, as we both agree that this has been the public ethos to date, then I will as loudly as anyone hail them as heroes. We will find out soon enough. |  |
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| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:39 - Nov 3 with 1610 views | Uxbridge |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:35 - Nov 3 by Fuggie |
Agree with the supporters philosophy, especially dealing with past owners ,however these are swans fans who took over the club, at great risk to themselves in most cases. I do not see an issue with them being reward for the risk they took.
If I join this speculation how about this solution;
Assuming 50% of shares are made available for sale the holders sells 75% their holding to the new investor and the remainder is gifted to the trust. This would probably benefit nearly all parties as the Trust share holding increases without any expenditure. Not sure of the tax consequence of the gifting of shares on the original 50% holders but I am sure the sales proceeds would be more than adequate..
New shareholding [I Think]: 37.5% New Investor, 33.5% Trust & 19% Old Investors [Post edited 3 Nov 2014 18:37]
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That would be absolutely fabulous. | |
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| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:43 - Nov 3 with 1592 views | Fuggie |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:39 - Nov 3 by Uxbridge |
That would be absolutely fabulous. |
I did use the word "assuming" which from my 1st post means I am well and truly f**ked. | | | |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:45 - Nov 3 with 1583 views | Uxbridge |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:43 - Nov 3 by Fuggie |
I did use the word "assuming" which from my 1st post means I am well and truly f**ked. |
Now I didn't say it was very likely either  | |
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| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:46 - Nov 3 with 1576 views | MrSwan |
I would love to see what they spend these dividends on. | |
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| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:50 - Nov 3 with 1559 views | Fuggie |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:46 - Nov 3 by MrSwan |
I would love to see what they spend these dividends on. |
One has had a new Maserati I can you tell you that as I he blocked the outside lane for a considerable time trying to find the indicator. | | | |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:53 - Nov 3 with 1545 views | giantstoneater |
I have absolutely no grasp of anything to do with business or shares a 100 Abbey national shares was all I ever had and I dare say that the average Swans fan has the same amount of knowledge. Perhaps for us to have an extended run at this level sooner or later we would have to go down this route but for most of us all we want to know is can we trust the two names that have been mentioned, Moore and his oppo and also the baseball club that he sold what state is it in now? |  | | |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:55 - Nov 3 with 1532 views | monmouth |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:33 - Nov 3 by _ |
Whoa back don't get carried away with all that crap.
Everything is relative and trust me, they were "investors" back then with perhaps, perhaps the exception of Martin Morgan. They were all very pally with Doug Sharpe around that time and Doug wouldn't have done too bad from SCFC even during "those days" |
Sorry for the ignorance but can someone tell me why Brian Katzen, serial entrepreneur, got involved if it wasn't for some reasonable probability of future return? Yes, no one could anticipate the reality of what's happened, but is anyone contending he gave his cash out of the goodness of his heart?
There's some hard headed 'businessmen' on that board and external internet scrutiny by the 'masses' might just be the best or only defence we have. By all means give benefit of doubt but not at the expense of equally hard headed evaluation of actions not words. The only actions I've seen so far is nebulous PR talk of the need for 'investment' and a clear provocation of the Trust (given the response - a letter totally distancing themselves from the rhetoric.) [Post edited 3 Nov 2014 18:57]
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| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:55 - Nov 3 with 1526 views | MrSwan |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:50 - Nov 3 by Fuggie |
One has had a new Maserati I can you tell you that as I he blocked the outside lane for a considerable time trying to find the indicator. |
That was exactly what i was thinking. Surely if they have that much love for the club they would be willing to each put a percentage of the dividend back into the club but its all take, take, take. | |
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| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 19:31 - Nov 3 with 1446 views | perchrockjack |
Got nowt but respect for people who put money into the club as opposed to those who haven't but are whinging at how much they ve made,
On another planet sorry and vicious jealously and small minded back biting.
I'm over the moon that people who took thevrisk are being rewarded.
We need more .... | |
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| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 19:35 - Nov 3 with 1438 views | tomdickharry |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:29 - Nov 3 by _ |
Wow Paul... I can't believe I'd ever read a post like that from you... bravo son. |
Your not alone.
We have read a great deal recently about the shareholding of the Trust,consequently let us consider the position of the Trust board if and when an investment offer is placed before them.Who instructs them whether to accept or defray the offer,the fans circa 18000 or the voting members of the Trust circa 122.Guidance please. | | | |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 19:37 - Nov 3 with 1434 views | _ |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 19:31 - Nov 3 by perchrockjack |
Got nowt but respect for people who put money into the club as opposed to those who haven't but are whinging at how much they ve made,
On another planet sorry and vicious jealously and small minded back biting.
I'm over the moon that people who took thevrisk are being rewarded.
We need more .... |
Can you be honest in telling everyone how much you put into the club/Trust back then and how long you'd gone without watching the Swans at all.
Be honest now as God is your witness.
This means less to you for very obvious reasons so please try and see why the majority of posters feel they have an awful lot to lose. | |
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| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 19:44 - Nov 3 with 1411 views | marchamjack |
If I was one of the local Swansea born and bred investors (forget the outsiders who haven't got the same emotional investment), ther background being similar to mine in terms of supporting our club and having family in the area and where I'm from, i would want 2 things out of where I am now:
1. a return on my investment that delivers a very good financial return and sets me and my family up best I can
2. at the same time (and acknoweldging that this will cost me money, but accepting that fact given all I've said above) some way of giving something to the Trust that goes as far as I can to help their interests and by turn the good/safe keeping of the club.
These 2 things may be mutually exclusive in the end, but that's how I would genuinely want to go into this and on no other basis. I couldn't live with myself otherwise, genuinely. I hope the locals at least have the club at heart in the same way. |  |
| Oh,..Dave, what's occuring? |
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| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 19:54 - Nov 3 with 1389 views | headcleaner |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:46 - Nov 3 by MrSwan |
I would love to see what they spend these dividends on. |
A throne maybe :) [Post edited 3 Nov 2014 19:56]
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| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 19:54 - Nov 3 with 1389 views | headcleaner |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 18:46 - Nov 3 by MrSwan |
I would love to see what they spend these dividends on. |
A throne maybe  | | | |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 20:08 - Nov 3 with 1362 views | LeonisGod |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 16:04 - Nov 3 by monmouth |
I've absolutely no beef with them getting dividends but I, like many others have long been banging Parlay's drum above about matching incentives to the fanbase.
As part of that I'd also like to see reintroduction of the trust membership being part of the season ticket price, but this time fully funded by the club (ie in effect a price reduction even though the overall price paid might be the same). So take your dividend but also benefit the club and strengthen the trust. It seems again to me as a relative expat outsider that the trust has become rather an inconvenience. If they really care about the club, the directors should be looking to make it a bigger inconvenience, not trying to portray it as a blocker.
It seems like the time is approaching when they will be put to the test. I hope they remember that excessive cash is temporary (they'll all be rich anyway), peddling a lie for 10 years and proving you have no real moral courage is permanent, and inescapable. |
Interesting thoughts Monmouth. If the club have nothing to be feared, why shouldn't they strengthen the links with the fans through the trust? I must admit for all the platitudes about 'fan ownership' you constantly read about in the press, in reality it doesn't feel any different to a normal club. This is our USP and they should build the links and make them genuinely mean something. |  | | |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 20:12 - Nov 3 with 1357 views | MoscowJack |
A win-win situation, and a bit of a compromise from both sides, would be for the Directors to take 80% of the money for their shares and "donate" 20% to the Trust. This will get the Trust over the 25%.
I love Lisa's earlier idea very much but, as she said herself, it's never ever going to happen. It would be nice to see so much money going back into the Club, but it's sadly just a brilliant idea.
I really don't think there's ANY option for anyone to sell without ensuring the total and absolute protection of the Trust in the process.
If it can't be done, 18,000 feet (actually, 36,000 feet....if everyone has two feet, of course!!) should marching to the Liberty and I'll be on the first flight back.
This is a HUGE crossroads for our Club. If we accept the first offer that comes along and it doesn't totally protect the future of the Swansea City Trust then we really didn't learn anything from the Silver Shield, Lewis, and Petty era.
It's really that simple in my eyes. | |
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| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 20:13 - Nov 3 with 1352 views | pikeypaul |
£300,000 that's less than one of our players AGENTS picks up off the club in 6 weeks and every further 6 weeks the player remains here for "allowing" him to sign a new contract.
Good luck to the people who saved the club the greed lays elsewhere. |  |
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| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 20:46 - Nov 3 with 1287 views | Starsky |
| A million quid for the shareholders It's official! on 20:12 - Nov 3 by MoscowJack |
A win-win situation, and a bit of a compromise from both sides, would be for the Directors to take 80% of the money for their shares and "donate" 20% to the Trust. This will get the Trust over the 25%.
I love Lisa's earlier idea very much but, as she said herself, it's never ever going to happen. It would be nice to see so much money going back into the Club, but it's sadly just a brilliant idea.
I really don't think there's ANY option for anyone to sell without ensuring the total and absolute protection of the Trust in the process.
If it can't be done, 18,000 feet (actually, 36,000 feet....if everyone has two feet, of course!!) should marching to the Liberty and I'll be on the first flight back.
This is a HUGE crossroads for our Club. If we accept the first offer that comes along and it doesn't totally protect the future of the Swansea City Trust then we really didn't learn anything from the Silver Shield, Lewis, and Petty era.
It's really that simple in my eyes. |
Unfortunately, not everyone on here has 2 feet. |  |
| It's just the internet, init. |
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