| Serco on 08:03 - May 1 with 320 views | AnotherJohn |
| Serco on 07:01 - May 1 by Scotia |
Again they can get those "benefits ' elsewhere in Europe. I couldn't live on free housing and pin money alone. Nobody could.
Asylum seekers are not causing an unmitigated disaster - they account for somewhere between 7 and 10 percent of immigrants, just 0.5% of the population.
Immigration is overwhelming services but we need those immigrants. If we need them, and we do, we should provide infrastructure for them and everyone else.
We don't because of underinvestment. That's down to the Tories. |
I think the problem with this argument is that mass immigration has coincided with falling per capita productivity, increasing welfare spending, rising national debt, and in short a deterioration in the nation's public finances. Taxation is already at record post-war levels, so higher taxation is not an easy solution. It was not the case that the Tories (in the period after the coalition) were a low-spending government. Under the May and Johnson administrations there was an upward trend in both welfare spending and public debt (even with the dip in 2022). How would the extra investment ideally needed have been funded? You say the UK does not have a problem, but I think anybody looking at the current national finances and worsening situation would disagree. And as far as immigration (a wider issue than just asylum seekers) and pressure on housing goes, there seems to me a very obvious link, given the unprecedented increase in the UK population since 2000. Labour's current house building target will not even keep up with the projected future rise in population in the planning period (all down to expected immigration), let alone relieve existing pressures. |  | |  |
| Serco on 08:53 - May 1 with 295 views | Scotia |
| Serco on 08:03 - May 1 by AnotherJohn |
I think the problem with this argument is that mass immigration has coincided with falling per capita productivity, increasing welfare spending, rising national debt, and in short a deterioration in the nation's public finances. Taxation is already at record post-war levels, so higher taxation is not an easy solution. It was not the case that the Tories (in the period after the coalition) were a low-spending government. Under the May and Johnson administrations there was an upward trend in both welfare spending and public debt (even with the dip in 2022). How would the extra investment ideally needed have been funded? You say the UK does not have a problem, but I think anybody looking at the current national finances and worsening situation would disagree. And as far as immigration (a wider issue than just asylum seekers) and pressure on housing goes, there seems to me a very obvious link, given the unprecedented increase in the UK population since 2000. Labour's current house building target will not even keep up with the projected future rise in population in the planning period (all down to expected immigration), let alone relieve existing pressures. |
There are far too many relatively low paid jobs in the service economy which reduces productivity and require immigrant labour force at present. It's largely before my days but Maggie T has to take a large amount of responsibility for that. Pre Brexit a lot of these would have been filled with transient eastern Europeans who earned a few quid and went home - now they're African / Asian and here to stay.
We can't afford our welfare bill, it's far too expensive. But just look at the furore around Labour's plan to cut the WFA and disability benefits. Look at the comments I've received when I've suggetsed we can't afford to keep the triple lock. It's not popular but our welfare bill has to be slashed. Too many people who don't need financial help get it and others are wealthy on benefits alone.
The Tories may not have been low spend, but they didn't spend enough. Then when the econonmic and health burden of Covid came along we weren't in a poisiton to handle it or then recover from it. So we ended up in a worse state.
Yes we need to pay more tax - ideally targetted at those that can afford it, but the burden is everyones. Such as immediatley revoking the cynical reduction in NI contributions invoked by Sunak's government for no other reason than to try and pinch a few votes and give Starmer a big problem to solve as PM.
The housing crisis hasn't been addressed since the council house sell off, it'll take several govenrments a few decades to solve - together with heaps of cash.
Ultimately we have to hold the government of the time to account. We can't / don't really do that at the moment for various reasons that could be a thread on it's own. | | | |
| Serco on 09:25 - May 1 with 278 views | Scotia |
| Serco on 07:59 - May 1 by Boundy |
When will someone acknowledge the glaringly obvious differential between documented application for asylum and the undocumented chancers .they're the ones we don't need or do you believe that someone breaking our laws should be given the same considerations. |
Everyone does acknowledge that. It's why they need to be processed and sent home if we can send them home.
We need more Border Force officers. The Tories reduced their number.
We need to stop them wanting to come here in the first place and if they do, stop them jumping in a boat in France. That needs cooperation with France. Farage obviosly can't do this, the French hate him and he hates them. The Tories didn't do this - Yvette Cooper was the first home secretary to visit the relevant part of France in 5 years despite the Tories spending millions in the area.
It may yet work:-
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/small-boat-migrants-yvette-cooper | | | |
| Serco on 10:28 - May 1 with 263 views | Boundy |
| Serco on 09:25 - May 1 by Scotia |
Everyone does acknowledge that. It's why they need to be processed and sent home if we can send them home.
We need more Border Force officers. The Tories reduced their number.
We need to stop them wanting to come here in the first place and if they do, stop them jumping in a boat in France. That needs cooperation with France. Farage obviosly can't do this, the French hate him and he hates them. The Tories didn't do this - Yvette Cooper was the first home secretary to visit the relevant part of France in 5 years despite the Tories spending millions in the area.
It may yet work:-
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/small-boat-migrants-yvette-cooper |
Those who come on boats do not need processing , why should they be ,they come here illegally , Labour have been in power now for nearly a year and you're still blaming the Torys. I'm glad you recognise we need to stop making the UK a destination of choice, this would be a start by stop making accommodation freely available ,governments do it for veterans who are reliant on charities at best but so scrot from ---------- ( fill in the blanks yourself) gets it for nothing ,Serco/Labour are guaranteeing a minimum contract with private landlords of 5 years what effect that's going to have on the rental sector , it seems the locals can suffer but not some some chancer. | |
| "In a free society, the State is the servant of the people—not the master." |
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| Serco on 10:55 - May 1 with 254 views | Scotia |
| Serco on 10:28 - May 1 by Boundy |
Those who come on boats do not need processing , why should they be ,they come here illegally , Labour have been in power now for nearly a year and you're still blaming the Torys. I'm glad you recognise we need to stop making the UK a destination of choice, this would be a start by stop making accommodation freely available ,governments do it for veterans who are reliant on charities at best but so scrot from ---------- ( fill in the blanks yourself) gets it for nothing ,Serco/Labour are guaranteeing a minimum contract with private landlords of 5 years what effect that's going to have on the rental sector , it seems the locals can suffer but not some some chancer. |
This is a problem caused by the Tories and will take years to sort out. If there was an election tomorrow and Reform took control on Saturday, the problems would still be there for a couple of years and would still be the Tories fault. Other problems such as the NHS situation will take decades to sort and are the Tories fault.
There is no legal route for asylum seekers. We could process them in France and ferry the refugees over but that wouldn't stop the failed asylum claimants trying in dinghies again and once they were here we wouldn't know who they were and couldn't send them back to France. I also don't think the Mail/Express/Telegraph/Times/GBNews/talkradio/Andrew Neil etc would like that very much.
The community is much safer with immigrants housed somewhere (I'm not adverse to former barracks, Bibby Stockholm type facilities) than being put on the street. That's not an option.
They don't come here for anything they can't get elsewhere in Europe (healthcare, accomadation etc). They come to work.
If everyone who has an issue with illegal / uncontrolled immigration (which seems to be the majority) stopped using the places they work they'd shut down. If they were regularly raided by border force / HMRC they'd shut down. That's part of the solution.
One of my best mates is considering standing as a Reform candidate at the Senedd election, he would be dreadful if elected, but he's a mate. He uses the car wash by the range regularly, has a take away delivered twice a week, and gets his hair cut at a Turkish barbers every fortnight. And his family currently rely on benefits. | | | |
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