| Measles and vaccination 09:24 - Jul 21 with 1705 views | saint901 |
Last year Canada suffered a measles outbreak sufficient to place it into the top ten countries for such outbreaks.
The source of the outbreak was traced to a single individual who attended a Mennonite event. The Mennonite community is one which embraces a philosophy in which some aspects of modern life and science are given up in favour of a more simple regimen.
If we accept that members of such a community are intelligent and aware that a reduced use of vaccines exposes them and their children to otherwise preventable diseases (some of which are very dangerous), then are members of the wider community equally able to refuse to be in shared spaces with the unvaccinated ?
The measles vaccines have been around since the early 1960's. Before the vaccine became a mass exercise, it's estimated that some 2 million people - mainly children - dies each year from measles. There ahs been a slight uptick in recorded cases in recent year as vaccine hesitancy spreads.
Herd immunity from measles requires a vaccine take up of around 95% of the population. Canada and the UK (and the US) fall short of that.
Given the proven safety record of measles (I'm not saying that in some very rare cases the vaccine has not had side effects and I'm not getting into the nonsense around the MMR version) is there a case for legislating here to ensure the majority of the population is protected? |  | | |  |
| Measles and vaccination on 10:13 - Jul 24 with 250 views | saint901 |
Thank you for the non reply (again) Mr Jelly.
You are correct that I am in a loop. It starts with reading a statement - checking its references and sources - deciding if that evidence has any weight and then deciding if I believe all/some/none of the statement. I'm sorry if that offends.
I suggest you are in a loop. Yours is that having arrived at a certain position you need to justify it but in the absence of any proof you think it reasonable to assume or extrapolate based on the conclusion you have already reached. I suggest that this is illogical.
It does not help of course that when asked for proof or evidence, your response is to deflect, distract, disparage and insult. I suggest that this is childish (and boring).
The latter response is straight out of the conspiracy theorists playbook of course. A playbook happily seized upon by (for example) the MAGA supporters who have gone a little further and added "attack" to any rebuttal of their position.
Regardless. If you had a baby - who are susceptible to the worse effects of measles - and you knew that an unvaccinated person would be within infection distance of said baby, would you be justified in refusing that unvaccinated person permission to be within that distance (if you had that power) or be willing to accept a restriction in your life to suit the preferences of that unvaccinated person? | | | |
| Measles and vaccination on 12:16 - Jul 24 with 202 views | mushinexile |
| Measles and vaccination on 10:13 - Jul 24 by saint901 |
Thank you for the non reply (again) Mr Jelly.
You are correct that I am in a loop. It starts with reading a statement - checking its references and sources - deciding if that evidence has any weight and then deciding if I believe all/some/none of the statement. I'm sorry if that offends.
I suggest you are in a loop. Yours is that having arrived at a certain position you need to justify it but in the absence of any proof you think it reasonable to assume or extrapolate based on the conclusion you have already reached. I suggest that this is illogical.
It does not help of course that when asked for proof or evidence, your response is to deflect, distract, disparage and insult. I suggest that this is childish (and boring).
The latter response is straight out of the conspiracy theorists playbook of course. A playbook happily seized upon by (for example) the MAGA supporters who have gone a little further and added "attack" to any rebuttal of their position.
Regardless. If you had a baby - who are susceptible to the worse effects of measles - and you knew that an unvaccinated person would be within infection distance of said baby, would you be justified in refusing that unvaccinated person permission to be within that distance (if you had that power) or be willing to accept a restriction in your life to suit the preferences of that unvaccinated person? |
Saint 901. He isn't listening to you because he is a high functioning imbecile.
We are not listening to him either because we are rational human beings.
Don't be "triggered" by him/her/it. Just remember Mark Twain's doctrine: "Never argue with a fool. A passer by may not be able to tell the difference." | |
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| Measles and vaccination on 13:42 - Jul 24 with 161 views | Jellybaby |
| Measles and vaccination on 10:13 - Jul 24 by saint901 |
Thank you for the non reply (again) Mr Jelly.
You are correct that I am in a loop. It starts with reading a statement - checking its references and sources - deciding if that evidence has any weight and then deciding if I believe all/some/none of the statement. I'm sorry if that offends.
I suggest you are in a loop. Yours is that having arrived at a certain position you need to justify it but in the absence of any proof you think it reasonable to assume or extrapolate based on the conclusion you have already reached. I suggest that this is illogical.
It does not help of course that when asked for proof or evidence, your response is to deflect, distract, disparage and insult. I suggest that this is childish (and boring).
The latter response is straight out of the conspiracy theorists playbook of course. A playbook happily seized upon by (for example) the MAGA supporters who have gone a little further and added "attack" to any rebuttal of their position.
Regardless. If you had a baby - who are susceptible to the worse effects of measles - and you knew that an unvaccinated person would be within infection distance of said baby, would you be justified in refusing that unvaccinated person permission to be within that distance (if you had that power) or be willing to accept a restriction in your life to suit the preferences of that unvaccinated person? |
901, I am not offended by you in the slightest, I rather like you. I can indulge you by (trying to) answer your question yet again, but I don't think you have ears to hear and there was that time where you were so offended that you refused to talk to me, until you came round again, lol., so it can be tricky with sensitive souls.
I will try one more time - We live in a hierarchical structured society. The likes of you and me may be fairly near the bottom of the pyramid, but if you keep going up that pyramid and you can do this by following who is funding who, then you get to a much smaller group of people, they hold the purse strings, so they have power, you keep going until you are left with a cabal of powerful people or a series of competing cabals. This is imo wholly logical. The other aspect is spiritual, Good vs evil, which again is completely logical, as we know both exist.
I think we have all arrived at certain positions 901, I don't need to justify my position to you or anyone and likewise in reverse you neither.
If I have insulted you 901, I apologize, I am invariably being playful, but maybe you are not picking up on the tone.
MAGA supporters and what they think is of no concern to me, you know I have said many times that Trump is a bad actor (the Epstein case has only made me say I told you so, to those who considered him a saviour). But are you calling all of them conspiracy theorists, that's quite a few??
Your last point shows how fear is used to control people. Bodily autonomy is enshrined in Geneva Convention law, but you can see how this could be undone for "the greater good" and enforced vaccinations become the norm and then you have a two tier society and a major problem.
I did not refuse the convid jab to annoy people, I did it because I did not trust it, I did not know the ingredients, I couldn't understand why the dose was the same regardless of size of recipient, the long term side effects, why it was done in lockstep and because people in power do not always have our best interests at heart. I don't regret making that decision and I have yet to meet anyone who does, if that puts me in a gulag one day or makes me unable to buy and sell via digital id then so be it.
Have a good day 901 | |
| I wholly disapprove of what you say and will defend to the death your right to say it. |
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| Measles and vaccination on 12:02 - Jul 25 with 83 views | arfurdent |
Puts me in mind of the propaganda pushed out by Government officials over Mad Cow Disease.
Oh the joyful sight of Selwyn Gummer and his kids eating beefburgurs to show there was nothing to worry about. Mind you it would be difficult to tell if a politician actually got Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease (vCJD)
There are still a lot of cases appearing. A neighbour developed it, poor man, totally destroyed his life and marriage |  |
| So Long and Thanks for all the Fish |
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| Measles and vaccination on 12:31 - Jul 25 with 70 views | 1885_SFC |
Reminds me of that old joke...
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