| Sam Field - Centre Back 09:27 - Aug 3 with 4486 views | DubaiR |
For me think he suits CB better, always looked assured and more physical at centre back. I think the game bypasses him in midfield, I know ore season but Brentford just played through him. With cook and JCS always injured, morrison and field at centre back. |  | | |  |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 10:00 - Aug 3 with 2504 views | gazza1 |
And whom will play midfield doing Field's job?? if he is CB. |  | | |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 10:10 - Aug 3 with 2454 views | GaryBannister86 |
It seems like so many posts on writing off Field, Cook etc on this message board. Personally, I have little doubt it will be those stalwarts that hold us together through the bleak winter months when we suddenly realise the YouTube videos of the new signings didn't actually represent their true abilities.
Having players like these guys, and Dunne, is a rare treat and I don't understand why they don't get appreciated more. Field has earned the right to have a lukewarm pre-season game with his years of service. He'll be great next Saturday. |  | | |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 10:27 - Aug 3 with 2382 views | DubaiR |
I wasn't writing him off, just think makes for a better centre back. Personally dont think he is a great holding midfielder player.
As to who would play centre mid personally varane, Morgan and liked chair in there. Chair plays on the half turn and gets us forward. Also think that will be where benni naturally ends up and he has a presence about him | | | |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 10:55 - Aug 3 with 2282 views | gazza1 |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 10:27 - Aug 3 by DubaiR |
I wasn't writing him off, just think makes for a better centre back. Personally dont think he is a great holding midfielder player.
As to who would play centre mid personally varane, Morgan and liked chair in there. Chair plays on the half turn and gets us forward. Also think that will be where benni naturally ends up and he has a presence about him |
Madness and very wrong to expect Morgan or Chair to do Field's job!!!!! They have about zero chance of doing it!!!! He is a DCM player whom can occasionally play a more forward role. | | | |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 11:00 - Aug 3 with 2236 views | dmm |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 10:55 - Aug 3 by gazza1 |
Madness and very wrong to expect Morgan or Chair to do Field's job!!!!! They have about zero chance of doing it!!!! He is a DCM player whom can occasionally play a more forward role. |
Agreed. CM is one of our problem areas so moving one of our best DCMs to CB would be ridiculous. I don't understand why Stephan did it yesterday when Mbengue was on the bench. |  | | |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 11:09 - Aug 3 with 2222 views | Wilkinswatercarrier |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 10:55 - Aug 3 by gazza1 |
Madness and very wrong to expect Morgan or Chair to do Field's job!!!!! They have about zero chance of doing it!!!! He is a DCM player whom can occasionally play a more forward role. |
Varane, Morgan CM, Chair 10. Simples. | |
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| Sam Field - Centre Back on 11:14 - Aug 3 with 2195 views | Watford_Ranger |
As stated, we aren’t exactly blessed with defensive midfield options and I’m not confident we’ll have Varane much longer. But when he has played at the back he’s been good IMO. Think maybe that’s the next step for him as he nears 30. | | | |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 11:15 - Aug 3 with 2199 views | Rangersw12 |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 11:09 - Aug 3 by Wilkinswatercarrier |
Varane, Morgan CM, Chair 10. Simples. |
Christ we are going to be so easy to play against
Also Varane has been missing majority of pre season so is he actually fit enough to start on Saturday | | | |
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| Sam Field - Centre Back on 12:03 - Aug 3 with 2069 views | 1JD |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 11:00 - Aug 3 by dmm |
Agreed. CM is one of our problem areas so moving one of our best DCMs to CB would be ridiculous. I don't understand why Stephan did it yesterday when Mbengue was on the bench. |
CM is one of our biggest problem areas because of Field. He is the one common denominator for years now.
Now, to balance this up, Field wouldn’t be a problem in an Ainsworth type side, for instance. One that misses out the midfield. But in a club model that wants to play out from that back, and play through midfield, Field is a huge and significant problem that remains unsolved, and has been under Warburton, Beale, Marti and now Stephan. Not for his defensive abilities - which are fantastic and unrivalled in this division - but for his passing abilities, which are non-existent, and hold the team back.
With a stated club game model of passing, possession-based football - execution of that strategy remains completely illusive because those in CM are simply not technical enough. Something I am amazed the club has not solved. And the harsh reality is Field is not good enough to play in that stated club model at 6 or 8, at least as a starter.
It’s the elephant in the room. | | | |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 12:17 - Aug 3 with 2020 views | DavieQPR |
Colback has more than likely been given a deadline. If he doesn't re sign I expect to see another midfielder in. |  | | |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 12:21 - Aug 3 with 1969 views | QPR_Hibs |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 12:03 - Aug 3 by 1JD |
CM is one of our biggest problem areas because of Field. He is the one common denominator for years now.
Now, to balance this up, Field wouldn’t be a problem in an Ainsworth type side, for instance. One that misses out the midfield. But in a club model that wants to play out from that back, and play through midfield, Field is a huge and significant problem that remains unsolved, and has been under Warburton, Beale, Marti and now Stephan. Not for his defensive abilities - which are fantastic and unrivalled in this division - but for his passing abilities, which are non-existent, and hold the team back.
With a stated club game model of passing, possession-based football - execution of that strategy remains completely illusive because those in CM are simply not technical enough. Something I am amazed the club has not solved. And the harsh reality is Field is not good enough to play in that stated club model at 6 or 8, at least as a starter.
It’s the elephant in the room. |
"With a stated club game model of passing, possession-based football - execution of that strategy remains completely illusive because those in CM are simply not technical enough."
Madsen is surely the most technical footballer at the club. And he is a midfielder.
I'd rather have Field in there, thanks. |  |
| "Remember to listen to me but look at her. Don't get it the wrong way round. That would be hideous." |
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| Sam Field - Centre Back on 12:25 - Aug 3 with 1933 views | Northernr |
I do like him there, particularly on the left of a three. |  | | |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 12:38 - Aug 3 with 1850 views | Burnleyhoop |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 12:25 - Aug 3 by Northernr |
I do like him there, particularly on the left of a three. |
Is that not Mbengue’s favoured position?
We are still struggling with the square peg, round hole syndrome and not seemingly capable of fielding a balanced side that fits with our supposed preferred playing style, all of which stems from different recruitment philosophies across multiple seasons.
Will take multiple transfer windows to remedy, which is fine if we now intend to stick to the newly proposed club strategy for the next five years.
Not going to happen overnight and certainly not during this season. | | | |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 12:58 - Aug 3 with 1774 views | dmm |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 12:38 - Aug 3 by Burnleyhoop |
Is that not Mbengue’s favoured position?
We are still struggling with the square peg, round hole syndrome and not seemingly capable of fielding a balanced side that fits with our supposed preferred playing style, all of which stems from different recruitment philosophies across multiple seasons.
Will take multiple transfer windows to remedy, which is fine if we now intend to stick to the newly proposed club strategy for the next five years.
Not going to happen overnight and certainly not during this season. |
Mbengue is a right footed CB. | | | |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 13:20 - Aug 3 with 1675 views | Burnleyhoop |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 12:58 - Aug 3 by dmm |
Mbengue is a right footed CB. |
That strangely didn’t come on to replace Cook yesterday.
No Burrell either.
God only knows what the line up will look like on Saturday. | | | |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 13:50 - Aug 3 with 1564 views | 1JD |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 12:21 - Aug 3 by QPR_Hibs |
"With a stated club game model of passing, possession-based football - execution of that strategy remains completely illusive because those in CM are simply not technical enough."
Madsen is surely the most technical footballer at the club. And he is a midfielder.
I'd rather have Field in there, thanks. |
The whole ethos and style of play of a team that wants to play out from the back rests on the play making abilities of a #6. The DCM. The deep lying playmaker and destroyer. The Ale Faurlin role. The Adam Wharton role.
If the #6 can’t make himself available, continuously, in tight spaces, and turn on the ball and play out, as opposed to hiding, taking too many touches, or playing a wall pass straight back from whence it came - the entire strategy fails.
Field has played the #6 position the most in his QPR career. He can’t do it. Madsen is not comparable. But Varane is - he is a #6, but even he is only a marginal upgrade on Field’s (non)ability to play out. | | | |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 14:04 - Aug 3 with 1542 views | Wilkinswatercarrier |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 12:03 - Aug 3 by 1JD |
CM is one of our biggest problem areas because of Field. He is the one common denominator for years now.
Now, to balance this up, Field wouldn’t be a problem in an Ainsworth type side, for instance. One that misses out the midfield. But in a club model that wants to play out from that back, and play through midfield, Field is a huge and significant problem that remains unsolved, and has been under Warburton, Beale, Marti and now Stephan. Not for his defensive abilities - which are fantastic and unrivalled in this division - but for his passing abilities, which are non-existent, and hold the team back.
With a stated club game model of passing, possession-based football - execution of that strategy remains completely illusive because those in CM are simply not technical enough. Something I am amazed the club has not solved. And the harsh reality is Field is not good enough to play in that stated club model at 6 or 8, at least as a starter.
It’s the elephant in the room. |
Careful, the Sam Field fan club on here will string you up. Been saying this for 18 months, but people won't have it.
In fairness to Field, it says a lot about our recruitment and DS over the past 4 seasons that he was continually selected. And he can't be faulted for his effort, but a CM needs to be able to pass forward.
The only way for it to change will be Field either going CB (not going to happen as we don't play a 3 back line) or be dropped.
It'll be Varane and Morgan in the centre hopefully when everyone is fully fit. | |
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| Sam Field - Centre Back on 14:08 - Aug 3 with 1519 views | Northernr |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 14:04 - Aug 3 by Wilkinswatercarrier |
Careful, the Sam Field fan club on here will string you up. Been saying this for 18 months, but people won't have it.
In fairness to Field, it says a lot about our recruitment and DS over the past 4 seasons that he was continually selected. And he can't be faulted for his effort, but a CM needs to be able to pass forward.
The only way for it to change will be Field either going CB (not going to happen as we don't play a 3 back line) or be dropped.
It'll be Varane and Morgan in the centre hopefully when everyone is fully fit. |
It's not the 'Field fan club' on here you want to worry about. Have a word about the CEO who's renewed his contract twice in the last 18 months, including this summer. | | | |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 14:13 - Aug 3 with 1496 views | baz_qpr |
I thought we were much improved when Field went to LCB both with and without the ball. I certainly think it's an option. JS wants a 6 and a ball playing 8. I'd have Field in our team and frankly if its LCB or even LB I think he would be a better option than what we have available now |  | | |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 14:13 - Aug 3 with 1500 views | Hunterhoop |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 13:50 - Aug 3 by 1JD |
The whole ethos and style of play of a team that wants to play out from the back rests on the play making abilities of a #6. The DCM. The deep lying playmaker and destroyer. The Ale Faurlin role. The Adam Wharton role.
If the #6 can’t make himself available, continuously, in tight spaces, and turn on the ball and play out, as opposed to hiding, taking too many touches, or playing a wall pass straight back from whence it came - the entire strategy fails.
Field has played the #6 position the most in his QPR career. He can’t do it. Madsen is not comparable. But Varane is - he is a #6, but even he is only a marginal upgrade on Field’s (non)ability to play out. |
Is it as simple as that though? And is the game model the right game model? And is the question about Field purely related to the “6” role you describe.
In all good midfields (at all levels), there is a balance between touch, passing, technical ability on the ball, with legs, tackling, physicality and ability to win to the ball back.
Very few, if any, players at Championship level can do both sides of this coin very well. Very players in the Prem can. In recent history, Gerard would be the best “all rounder” in my opinion. At our level, the best recent example of a true all rounder was Faurlin, hence why we all loved him, but even his off the ball work and tackling was not good enough for the Prem (Warnock).
But I digress, if your/the club’s game model is to have a 6 who takes it on the turn, with a great first touch, who then sprays it around, then the model *should* have an 8 who is great off the ball, runs, tackles, competes, and can press. Sam Field is excellent for that at this level, so he absolutely can play there.
If a side wishes to play more traditionally where the DCM plays the “shield” role, like Shaun Derry, then the other midfielder needs to be able to pass it about well and progress you.
Fundamentally, I disagree that Sam Field is the issue or elephant in the room. I think the issue is that we have never found the great touch, take it on the turn, ball player to play alongside him (either as the QB at 6, or the in the 8 role). We thought we’d found it with Stefan Johansen. Remember how well he and Field played together and how well we played in that calendar year? No one thought Field was a problem them. The problem was we signed Johansen on a free and his legs went fairly quickly, and he became a liability off the ball. Since then, we tried Dozzell mainly, amongst others. They didn’t create anything and were barely and better progressing us forward.
Varane is better on the ball than Field, but not as good off it. They are ultimately fairly similar players as you have alluded to. But the issue is not having signed the ball playing midfielder. It’s not that Sam Field should be it and can’t. Hyperbole, I know, but it’s like saying Ilias Chair is the problem at 9 for us. He isn’t, because that’s not his role and we shouldn’t be asking him to play it. |  | | |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 14:22 - Aug 3 with 1478 views | JamesB1979 |
I agree with Hunter here. Field and Varane is the best partnership for us BUT it depends on Varane taking his game to next level. He needs to be more progressive and as said, he is showing signs of that. Whether it’s a confidence thing or something else, not sure. For me, we have certain players that start when fit irrespective and they are Field, Varane, Dunne, JCS, Chair. Although have they ever been fit at the same time…. | | | |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 14:37 - Aug 3 with 1416 views | Hunterhoop |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 14:04 - Aug 3 by Wilkinswatercarrier |
Careful, the Sam Field fan club on here will string you up. Been saying this for 18 months, but people won't have it.
In fairness to Field, it says a lot about our recruitment and DS over the past 4 seasons that he was continually selected. And he can't be faulted for his effort, but a CM needs to be able to pass forward.
The only way for it to change will be Field either going CB (not going to happen as we don't play a 3 back line) or be dropped.
It'll be Varane and Morgan in the centre hopefully when everyone is fully fit. |
It’s also not just a LFW Sam Field club.
The season before last Sam Field won Players’ Player of The Year (and the Fans’ version) too.
Last season Sam Field was the runner up to Jimmy Dunne in the Players’ Player of the Year.
So the people who have played in the same team as him for the last two years think he’s pretty good and doing his job… | | | |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 14:48 - Aug 3 with 1388 views | 1JD |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 14:13 - Aug 3 by Hunterhoop |
Is it as simple as that though? And is the game model the right game model? And is the question about Field purely related to the “6” role you describe.
In all good midfields (at all levels), there is a balance between touch, passing, technical ability on the ball, with legs, tackling, physicality and ability to win to the ball back.
Very few, if any, players at Championship level can do both sides of this coin very well. Very players in the Prem can. In recent history, Gerard would be the best “all rounder” in my opinion. At our level, the best recent example of a true all rounder was Faurlin, hence why we all loved him, but even his off the ball work and tackling was not good enough for the Prem (Warnock).
But I digress, if your/the club’s game model is to have a 6 who takes it on the turn, with a great first touch, who then sprays it around, then the model *should* have an 8 who is great off the ball, runs, tackles, competes, and can press. Sam Field is excellent for that at this level, so he absolutely can play there.
If a side wishes to play more traditionally where the DCM plays the “shield” role, like Shaun Derry, then the other midfielder needs to be able to pass it about well and progress you.
Fundamentally, I disagree that Sam Field is the issue or elephant in the room. I think the issue is that we have never found the great touch, take it on the turn, ball player to play alongside him (either as the QB at 6, or the in the 8 role). We thought we’d found it with Stefan Johansen. Remember how well he and Field played together and how well we played in that calendar year? No one thought Field was a problem them. The problem was we signed Johansen on a free and his legs went fairly quickly, and he became a liability off the ball. Since then, we tried Dozzell mainly, amongst others. They didn’t create anything and were barely and better progressing us forward.
Varane is better on the ball than Field, but not as good off it. They are ultimately fairly similar players as you have alluded to. But the issue is not having signed the ball playing midfielder. It’s not that Sam Field should be it and can’t. Hyperbole, I know, but it’s like saying Ilias Chair is the problem at 9 for us. He isn’t, because that’s not his role and we shouldn’t be asking him to play it. |
I don’t disagree that the CM pairing is important.
And Field could still play a role as a box to box 8, a role I have quite liked him playing in recent times, as his energy, legs, and stamina (and goals) have worked well.
The issue is when you play Varane and Field. Neither of whom can turn on the ball and get this team playing. And Varane has pretty much nailed the #6 position, and I don’t believe you can play Field alongside him. We’ve done that loads and it’s drab.
So for me Field’s starting spot in this side - if it is to progress with its stated passing game - is at stake, as I think there are better (and needed) upgrades in that 8 role alongside Varane.
That’s where a new signing would come in and play. Or possibly Morgan takes it. Can’t see Madsen having the all round CM game needed there. | | | |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 15:18 - Aug 3 with 1303 views | Hunterhoop |
| Sam Field - Centre Back on 14:48 - Aug 3 by 1JD |
I don’t disagree that the CM pairing is important.
And Field could still play a role as a box to box 8, a role I have quite liked him playing in recent times, as his energy, legs, and stamina (and goals) have worked well.
The issue is when you play Varane and Field. Neither of whom can turn on the ball and get this team playing. And Varane has pretty much nailed the #6 position, and I don’t believe you can play Field alongside him. We’ve done that loads and it’s drab.
So for me Field’s starting spot in this side - if it is to progress with its stated passing game - is at stake, as I think there are better (and needed) upgrades in that 8 role alongside Varane.
That’s where a new signing would come in and play. Or possibly Morgan takes it. Can’t see Madsen having the all round CM game needed there. |
But earlier you have said it is specifically the “6” role where we need someone to reduced, turn, and play forward. That is Varane’s position. When Field plays alongside Varane, Field plays as the “8” effectively. He gets about and covers more ground, and it’s Varane who sits.
So either we need a better 6 than Varane who is more of the QB passer, you’re looking for. OR we don’t play a shape where your 6 does that and you ask the other central midfielder (let’s call it an 8 for now). If that is the case and the 6 is there to be a shield and not a turn and play forward role, then Field does that job better than Varane.
The issue is our inability to play the ball forward well. I don’t think you solve that by dropping the best tackler, and physical midfielder with the legs to get about the pitch. You sign a better ball player than the bloke you are asking to be the main ball player, just like we did by binning Dozzell and bringing in Varane.
What you’re actually doing is making a strong case to sell Varane and sign and pick a better ball player.
However, I personally think Varane can and will develop into a decent forward passer with more time in the league. I’d play Varane at 6, ask him to take it on the turn and play forward, and I would have Field alongside him doing the running, tackling, competing, and have him in the side for his superb reading of the game when the oppo have it.
If Varane can’t do that passing role, sell him and try to sign someone who can. [Post edited 3 Aug 15:38]
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| Sam Field - Centre Back on 15:33 - Aug 3 with 1273 views | dmm |
I think it was against Toulouse when Chair was playing 10 but was dropping back to take the ball from Walsh passing short. Chair performed the role well and I thought we would see more of that but sadly we haven't. | | | |
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