| Devs v Cardiff 18:21 - Oct 24 with 5871 views | aston_hoop |
Gives us an idea of players who haven't traveled to Derby then, really disappointed Kolli is being frozen out
|  |
| |  |
| Devs v Cardiff on 21:27 - Oct 24 with 2385 views | Northernr |
| Devs v Cardiff on 19:49 - Oct 24 by QPROslo |
"frozen out" with his mush barely leaving room for the starting 11 names? |
That's a fan account. |  | | |
| Devs v Cardiff on 22:36 - Oct 24 with 2061 views | nix |
| Devs v Cardiff on 20:35 - Oct 24 by Wilkinswatercarrier |
Agree. Interested to know who arranges the loans, if anyone. |
Yes that’ would be really interesting to know more about that. How hard is it to get a loan for our players? Do we get any leverage about how much match time they’ll get. Are there some positions that are easier to place than others? Who arranges the loans? What’s the thinking about the benefits of loans from the professionals- for instance is it good to get any kind of men’s football or are the club only interested in clubs that play more technical football? [Post edited 25 Oct 3:44]
|  | | |
| Devs v Cardiff on 05:24 - Oct 25 with 1697 views | QPROslo |
| Devs v Cardiff on 21:27 - Oct 24 by Northernr |
That's a fan account. |
Good info, that was unclear to me. |  | | |
| Devs v Cardiff (n/t) on 09:46 - Oct 25 with 1343 views | gazza1 |
| Devs v Cardiff on 18:28 - Oct 24 by Esox_Lucius |
It's a disgrace that Frey gets selected over Kolli. |
[Post edited 25 Oct 9:56]
| | | |
| Devs v Cardiff on 10:08 - Oct 25 with 1270 views | Northernr |
| Devs v Cardiff on 19:50 - Oct 24 by nix |
They have to be GOOD ENOUGH. If they play and we lose then everyone will rant about results being sacrificed for the ‘project’. As I said before we’re playing youngish players who could be worth something - Burrell, Kone, Esquerdinha and Saito are hardly pensioners….I think we’ve got one of the youngest squads in the league. But it’s also a massive jump from DS to Championship level.
I saw Tuck play for the Premier Cup final and thought he looked really promising. Then I saw him play for Hampton and Richmond and he looked a bit out of his depth tbh. He needs game time against men, as does Sutton and the others. Otherwise they’re just too naive to play in the Championship. Morgan looks more like he’s ready but even he would benefit from a League 1 or 2 loan. Is Kolli willing to go out on loan? If so three months of men’s football would benefit him.
I think the mistake is made when they don’t go out on loan. Think how Joe Walsh would be a better player if he’d played more matches. He’s hardly played over the last couple of years. How can that help his development.
I trust Stephan to make these decisions. He’s got a lot of experience developing young players and most importantly he knows what goes on behind the scenes. We only know he said/she said and whispers from ITKs |
Absolutely they have to be good enough, but a lot of us said that when the development squad was getting hyped to the hilt in May and the new youth policy was being hailed as a great success because they beat Brentford.. Cups and things are nice, I certainly prefer it to the Chris Ramsey set up getting pumped 8 and 9 at Stevenage and Fleetwood, but it’s about how many make it to first team.
So far that team v Brentford has produced…
Salamon - now behind 36 yo semi-retired Ben Hamer in the picking order.
Putman - played in the farce at Plymouth, not seen since
Wilkie - same
McDowell - returned early from a loan at Bedford
Esquerdinha - couple of first team apps, now mostly doesn’t even make the bench
Morgan - has gone from first team regular to unused sub
Tuck - bombed out halfway through the summer, now on loan at Hampton cos the manager there knows him.
Bennie - doesn’t make the bench
Murphy - released
Sutton - can’t get in the Morecambe team
Dillon - 3 apps for Torquay, no goals.
Now it’s still early days for a lot of these, and I’m not saying this to be horrible to anybody, more to make a point about the value of downplaying rather than hyping, particularly with young players. Always under promise and over deliver. To read some of the posts on here after that Brentford game you’d think we were heading into Europe with a midfield of Tuck and Morgan.
One of the big issues is a lot of these boys get sent on lousy loans which do nothing for them or for us. | | | |
| Devs v Cardiff on 11:35 - Oct 25 with 1107 views | Wilkinswatercarrier |
| Devs v Cardiff on 10:08 - Oct 25 by Northernr |
Absolutely they have to be good enough, but a lot of us said that when the development squad was getting hyped to the hilt in May and the new youth policy was being hailed as a great success because they beat Brentford.. Cups and things are nice, I certainly prefer it to the Chris Ramsey set up getting pumped 8 and 9 at Stevenage and Fleetwood, but it’s about how many make it to first team.
So far that team v Brentford has produced…
Salamon - now behind 36 yo semi-retired Ben Hamer in the picking order.
Putman - played in the farce at Plymouth, not seen since
Wilkie - same
McDowell - returned early from a loan at Bedford
Esquerdinha - couple of first team apps, now mostly doesn’t even make the bench
Morgan - has gone from first team regular to unused sub
Tuck - bombed out halfway through the summer, now on loan at Hampton cos the manager there knows him.
Bennie - doesn’t make the bench
Murphy - released
Sutton - can’t get in the Morecambe team
Dillon - 3 apps for Torquay, no goals.
Now it’s still early days for a lot of these, and I’m not saying this to be horrible to anybody, more to make a point about the value of downplaying rather than hyping, particularly with young players. Always under promise and over deliver. To read some of the posts on here after that Brentford game you’d think we were heading into Europe with a midfield of Tuck and Morgan.
One of the big issues is a lot of these boys get sent on lousy loans which do nothing for them or for us. |
Agree. Yet somehow Kolli rarely plays yet Frey does. I mean come on!
Morgan sits on the bench despite just making the England U20 squad. Something the club was very happy to let everyone know about.
Esquadinha sometimes makes the bench despite only one fit LB at the club.
No CBs on the bench, rather 35yo Cook whom CN clearly didn't want.
CN stated on more than one occasion its about developing our own talent. So far I'd say its actually going backwards under him.
There appears to be very little joined up thinking, or has JS just done a Warburton and said 'none are good enough'?
Just a note on Morgan, he was by far the best player in the final and to good for that level. Even more of a waste as he can't do any worse than Varane at the moment. | |
| |
| Devs v Cardiff on 11:56 - Oct 25 with 1012 views | dmm |
| Devs v Cardiff on 10:08 - Oct 25 by Northernr |
Absolutely they have to be good enough, but a lot of us said that when the development squad was getting hyped to the hilt in May and the new youth policy was being hailed as a great success because they beat Brentford.. Cups and things are nice, I certainly prefer it to the Chris Ramsey set up getting pumped 8 and 9 at Stevenage and Fleetwood, but it’s about how many make it to first team.
So far that team v Brentford has produced…
Salamon - now behind 36 yo semi-retired Ben Hamer in the picking order.
Putman - played in the farce at Plymouth, not seen since
Wilkie - same
McDowell - returned early from a loan at Bedford
Esquerdinha - couple of first team apps, now mostly doesn’t even make the bench
Morgan - has gone from first team regular to unused sub
Tuck - bombed out halfway through the summer, now on loan at Hampton cos the manager there knows him.
Bennie - doesn’t make the bench
Murphy - released
Sutton - can’t get in the Morecambe team
Dillon - 3 apps for Torquay, no goals.
Now it’s still early days for a lot of these, and I’m not saying this to be horrible to anybody, more to make a point about the value of downplaying rather than hyping, particularly with young players. Always under promise and over deliver. To read some of the posts on here after that Brentford game you’d think we were heading into Europe with a midfield of Tuck and Morgan.
One of the big issues is a lot of these boys get sent on lousy loans which do nothing for them or for us. |
It's an interesting and timely issue you bring up, Clive, and I agree with you to a point. The majority of those you list from the cup winning side are 18/19 years old so still relatively young. As you said, it's early days. I do feel, however, there's more potential in that crop of youngsters than we've had in decades.
Furthermore, it seems to me that there's more emphasis on identifying and recruiting higher-rated youngsters like Akindileni, Smith, and Alemayehu, who were perhaps lured to us by the development path that the likes of Morgan and Kolli have traveled. But to keep that strategy alive a few more youngsters will need to make it through to the senior squad and get minutes. |  | | |
| Devs v Cardiff on 12:32 - Oct 25 with 928 views | SW_Ranger |
Liam Morrison (age 22)
Rhys Norrington-Davies (age 19) - (26) thanks PinnerR
Amadou Mbengue (age 23)
Esquerdinha (age 19)
Karamoko Dembélé (age 22)
Kōki Saitō (age 24)
Kwame Poku (age 24)
Harvey Vale (age 22)
Kieran Morgan (age 19)
Jonathan Varane (age 24)
Rumarn Burrell (age 24)
Richard Kone (age 22)
Rayan Kolli (age 20)
All above under 25, all have had first team playing time. That’s a young looking bunch of players stepping up for me. Kolli, Morgan, Esquerdinha the youngest crop are building minutes vs the next age band that are playing more minutes. Seems about right to me. Build, build and build: strength, knowledge and experience. If they get their heads down as Kone has done in his career then they could all do very well. Last thing they should be doing is whining.
Nice bunch of young players we have there though, huh!
Looking forward to seeing how they all develop.
Edit: Norrington-Davies age corrected [Post edited 25 Oct 15:11]
|  | | |
Login to get fewer ads
| Devs v Cardiff on 12:35 - Oct 25 with 914 views | PinnerR |
| Devs v Cardiff on 12:32 - Oct 25 by SW_Ranger |
Liam Morrison (age 22)
Rhys Norrington-Davies (age 19) - (26) thanks PinnerR
Amadou Mbengue (age 23)
Esquerdinha (age 19)
Karamoko Dembélé (age 22)
Kōki Saitō (age 24)
Kwame Poku (age 24)
Harvey Vale (age 22)
Kieran Morgan (age 19)
Jonathan Varane (age 24)
Rumarn Burrell (age 24)
Richard Kone (age 22)
Rayan Kolli (age 20)
All above under 25, all have had first team playing time. That’s a young looking bunch of players stepping up for me. Kolli, Morgan, Esquerdinha the youngest crop are building minutes vs the next age band that are playing more minutes. Seems about right to me. Build, build and build: strength, knowledge and experience. If they get their heads down as Kone has done in his career then they could all do very well. Last thing they should be doing is whining.
Nice bunch of young players we have there though, huh!
Looking forward to seeing how they all develop.
Edit: Norrington-Davies age corrected [Post edited 25 Oct 15:11]
|
Norrington -Davies is 26. |  | | |
| Devs v Cardiff on 13:06 - Oct 25 with 841 views | 1JD |
| Devs v Cardiff on 10:08 - Oct 25 by Northernr |
Absolutely they have to be good enough, but a lot of us said that when the development squad was getting hyped to the hilt in May and the new youth policy was being hailed as a great success because they beat Brentford.. Cups and things are nice, I certainly prefer it to the Chris Ramsey set up getting pumped 8 and 9 at Stevenage and Fleetwood, but it’s about how many make it to first team.
So far that team v Brentford has produced…
Salamon - now behind 36 yo semi-retired Ben Hamer in the picking order.
Putman - played in the farce at Plymouth, not seen since
Wilkie - same
McDowell - returned early from a loan at Bedford
Esquerdinha - couple of first team apps, now mostly doesn’t even make the bench
Morgan - has gone from first team regular to unused sub
Tuck - bombed out halfway through the summer, now on loan at Hampton cos the manager there knows him.
Bennie - doesn’t make the bench
Murphy - released
Sutton - can’t get in the Morecambe team
Dillon - 3 apps for Torquay, no goals.
Now it’s still early days for a lot of these, and I’m not saying this to be horrible to anybody, more to make a point about the value of downplaying rather than hyping, particularly with young players. Always under promise and over deliver. To read some of the posts on here after that Brentford game you’d think we were heading into Europe with a midfield of Tuck and Morgan.
One of the big issues is a lot of these boys get sent on lousy loans which do nothing for them or for us. |
Good post.
It’s also become clear this season that Kolli and Morgan (and Lloyd) only played last season due to needs must, not because it was part of the plan. PR disconnected from reality, again. | | | |
| Devs v Cardiff on 13:53 - Oct 25 with 688 views | cpgerber |
I think it's an unrealistic target to expect 2-3 home grown lads to come through the ranks into the 1st team every year. That just won't happen.
It would be fantastic to produce Eze's on a regular basis, but I think the current path of buying more established players in their early 20's and selling on has a better chance of success and we'll end up with fewer Travelmans and Shodipos.
That said, I am very curious as to the Kolli situation and believe he should be above Frey. And I think Morgan and Esquerdinha should get more minutes. But I also think results and a steady platform is important. I can't imagine it's a healthy "development environment" for youngsters to fight relegation battles. It might be good experience, but I don't think ideal development circumstances. So I am all for steading the ship and making sure we are a solid championship outfit, both on the field and financially, then start to groom the youngsters. Its not an overnight process.
And as I have said many times before, the likes of Cook and Hayden are very valuable old hands and experience that this "project" absolutely needs. |  | | |
| Devs v Cardiff on 14:14 - Oct 25 with 585 views | Ned_Kennedys |
| Devs v Cardiff on 11:35 - Oct 25 by Wilkinswatercarrier |
Agree. Yet somehow Kolli rarely plays yet Frey does. I mean come on!
Morgan sits on the bench despite just making the England U20 squad. Something the club was very happy to let everyone know about.
Esquadinha sometimes makes the bench despite only one fit LB at the club.
No CBs on the bench, rather 35yo Cook whom CN clearly didn't want.
CN stated on more than one occasion its about developing our own talent. So far I'd say its actually going backwards under him.
There appears to be very little joined up thinking, or has JS just done a Warburton and said 'none are good enough'?
Just a note on Morgan, he was by far the best player in the final and to good for that level. Even more of a waste as he can't do any worse than Varane at the moment. |
Just checked the league table again and yes we are 9th and could go back into the play off positions today. Yet you want to shoehorn a load of young players into the team ahead of those who have given us our best start to a season for years……
If you are having one forward on the bench you’d go Frey over Kolli IMO as he is the only like for like to replace Kone: as Chair showed on Wednesday he is a natural replacement for Burrell and Smyth or Dembele could also do that job. |  | | |
| Devs v Cardiff on 21:17 - Oct 26 with 217 views | Northernr |
| Devs v Cardiff on 11:56 - Oct 25 by dmm |
It's an interesting and timely issue you bring up, Clive, and I agree with you to a point. The majority of those you list from the cup winning side are 18/19 years old so still relatively young. As you said, it's early days. I do feel, however, there's more potential in that crop of youngsters than we've had in decades.
Furthermore, it seems to me that there's more emphasis on identifying and recruiting higher-rated youngsters like Akindileni, Smith, and Alemayehu, who were perhaps lured to us by the development path that the likes of Morgan and Kolli have traveled. But to keep that strategy alive a few more youngsters will need to make it through to the senior squad and get minutes. |
Well we can sit here and debate it, we'll only know in time.
I think there has been a shift towards trying to get younger bods in that development squad rather than having Charlie Owens hanging around forever just in case, or Mide Shodipo. And that's good.
But Dave Mc copped the usual load in the teeth on social media for saying they're not doing much different to what Ramsey was trying, what Steve Gallen was trying, and when push comes to shove QPR always just go and sign RND, Isaac Hayden etc, and he was right. As he often is. | | | |
| Devs v Cardiff on 21:55 - Oct 26 with 139 views | Northernr |
While I'm here a few of us also copped it for criticising the approach to that Plymouth game, which IMO was entirely performative a) so you can big up your youth programme by saying you've got 16 year olds in the first team and b) so you could fluff those players' potential future value by saying they made their debut when they were 16.
It did nothing for the team on the night, it wasn't fair to the supporters behind the goal, it wasn't fair to those players who were so horribly out of their depth, and it achieved nothing by way of development because, as predicted, none of them have been within a thousand miles of the first team since. | | | |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
