| Another 3 million invested on 18:56 - Apr 19 with 1381 views | 3swan |
| Another 3 million invested on 17:21 - Apr 19 by max936 |
I'd love to know as to what Mr Morris feels about it all, I wonder if they even informed him, they surely would need to.
Club made a operating loss of 12million or so last season, be interesting to see how much the club will lose or have lost this season, that's my point there as to be an end game the losses mounting up will force a change it will have to, if we did by some stroke of fortune and get promoted it would be very difficult to stay there, without significant investment every season, what with running costs wages for all staff and players etc.
The Coventry owner more or less said it all this morning, there used to be a top four, which grew to a top 6, but that is expanding ito a regular top 7/8 even, that takes serious money spent by seriously wealthy people, who want to grow the clubs they own.
Can't see this happening here, the MLS is much different due to there not being many clubs with the wealth needed to run MLS clubs, and more importantly is that they've virtually got a monopoly on the game with there not being promotion or relegation, so finishing bottom isn't ideal, but it changes things very little. |
"I'd love to know as to what Mr Morris feels about it all, I wonder if they even informed him, they surely would need to."
All depends what his working relationship with them is.
Has he worked with them or any of their associates before?
Why did he buy share separately and not part of the group.?
Why was he interested? Who introduced him to the club?
I'd be very surprised if he didn't go into it with his eyes wide open.
We can ignore football as this is all about business, and profit (or maybe tax loss) |  | |  |
| Another 3 million invested on 18:57 - Apr 19 with 1380 views | Gwyn737 |
| Another 3 million invested on 15:18 - Apr 19 by ReslovenSwan1 |
Not only do they claim to be businessmen but they are businessman. Why worry about them? They know how to look after themselves and have very deep pockets. Kaplan In particular made hundreds of millions out of Oak tree and sitting on hundred millions more at DC United.
He has made big money out of everything he has touched except Swansea city.
Be brave reject fear. New set up beefed up recruitment Coleman on station. He has taken charge with his people and they have money to spend this window with a highly promising and brave man manager and some very promising kids coming through.
The fans holding is heading to 5%. They will never invest. They are passengers and chose this role in 2015 when they declined to cash in. Now Taffy has to stand aside and leave it the Yanks.
I love Ben Cabango Williams and Coleman who typify SCFC These are lion hearted warriors. [Post edited 19 Apr 15:24]
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So ‘Taffy’ is ok, is it?
Doesn’t bother me in the slightest but I thought you were against all Welsh slurs? | | | |
| Another 3 million invested on 19:11 - Apr 19 with 1350 views | max936 |
| Another 3 million invested on 18:56 - Apr 19 by 3swan |
"I'd love to know as to what Mr Morris feels about it all, I wonder if they even informed him, they surely would need to."
All depends what his working relationship with them is.
Has he worked with them or any of their associates before?
Why did he buy share separately and not part of the group.?
Why was he interested? Who introduced him to the club?
I'd be very surprised if he didn't go into it with his eyes wide open.
We can ignore football as this is all about business, and profit (or maybe tax loss) |
I agree Swanny.
Oh and now I remember, that cheque you put in the post hasn't arrived  |  |
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| Another 3 million invested on 19:15 - Apr 19 with 1344 views | 3swan |
| Another 3 million invested on 19:11 - Apr 19 by max936 |
I agree Swanny.
Oh and now I remember, that cheque you put in the post hasn't arrived |
Don't worry I always post date them so you can't cash till 2025 so plenty of time for it to turn up
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| Another 3 million invested on 19:18 - Apr 19 with 1332 views | max936 |
| Another 3 million invested on 19:15 - Apr 19 by 3swan |
Don't worry I always post date them so you can't cash till 2025 so plenty of time for it to turn up
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I'll book that holiday now then in readiness  | |
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| Another 3 million invested on 20:12 - Apr 19 with 1297 views | ReslovenSwan1 |
| Another 3 million invested on 18:57 - Apr 19 by Gwyn737 |
So ‘Taffy’ is ok, is it?
Doesn’t bother me in the slightest but I thought you were against all Welsh slurs? |
Taffy is not a slur in my eyes I was called it bit in my early days in England. I have been warned off mentioning some low ball Swansea fans chants because discussing it, has an adverse effect on the advertising income of this charitable site.
Says it all really. |  |
| Wise sage since Toshack era |
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| Another 3 million invested on 20:20 - Apr 19 with 1295 views | QJumpingJack |
Is Ken Gude an investor? | | | |
| Another 3 million invested on 07:27 - Apr 20 with 1174 views | PawelAbbott |
| Another 3 million invested on 15:18 - Apr 19 by ReslovenSwan1 |
Not only do they claim to be businessmen but they are businessman. Why worry about them? They know how to look after themselves and have very deep pockets. Kaplan In particular made hundreds of millions out of Oak tree and sitting on hundred millions more at DC United.
He has made big money out of everything he has touched except Swansea city.
Be brave reject fear. New set up beefed up recruitment Coleman on station. He has taken charge with his people and they have money to spend this window with a highly promising and brave man manager and some very promising kids coming through.
The fans holding is heading to 5%. They will never invest. They are passengers and chose this role in 2015 when they declined to cash in. Now Taffy has to stand aside and leave it the Yanks.
I love Ben Cabango Williams and Coleman who typify SCFC These are lion hearted warriors. [Post edited 19 Apr 15:24]
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Why do those 3 typify SCFC?
Williams has only been here 3 months and hasn't exactly been setting the Championship alight. Martinez transformed the team in the first few months of becoming manager.
I can see what you mean with the other two.
Coleman has done a pretty poor job, gates are down, season ticket sales are down, recruitment is down. Yes, that's all the same direction the club has been going for 8 years.
Cabango is slow, cumbersome, changes direction slower than the Ark Royal and Championship standard at best. So, yes, I see your point, they are a fair reflection of SCFC over the past 8 years [Post edited 20 Apr 7:33]
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| Another 3 million invested on 13:17 - Apr 20 with 1109 views | shaggyrogers |
| Another 3 million invested on 16:11 - Apr 19 by Whiterockin |
Max we should all be very concerned and not just brush things under the carpet. First question is this investment needed to survive. Second question how much is left in the Swansea Football LLC pot before more investment is needed.
I still maintain that they are pushing for ownership of over 75%, why? Because a shareholder that holds 75.1% of the voting rights would have, effectively, complete control over the important and significant decisions that are made regarding the future direction of the football club. There are a number of decisions that can only be made when over 75% of shareholders agree. Exactly what are their plans. |
They have over 75% of the voting rights so do not need to pump in money for that reason | | | |
| Another 3 million invested on 13:20 - Apr 20 with 1105 views | shaggyrogers |
| Another 3 million invested on 20:20 - Apr 19 by QJumpingJack |
Is Ken Gude an investor? |
I'm laughing. That was tongue in cheek right ? | | | |
| Another 3 million invested on 13:23 - Apr 20 with 1102 views | shaggyrogers |
| Another 3 million invested on 15:41 - Apr 19 by felixstowe_jack |
Makes a nonsense out of those who still claim the owners are taking money out of the club. That is £25 million invested into the club over the last three years.
Our gate revenue does not even come close to covering our wage bill let alone all the other expenses involved in running a club. |
I actually think it is more than £25 mill if you include Morris. Jenkins comment about ' the next level ' is coming home to roost. The sellers never had the money to keep the club going like this ( Although they prob wouldn't have wasted as much either ) | | | |
| Another 3 million invested on 13:51 - Apr 20 with 1067 views | Whiterockin |
| Another 3 million invested on 13:17 - Apr 20 by shaggyrogers |
They have over 75% of the voting rights so do not need to pump in money for that reason |
I think you will find that voting rights does not give you the legal equivalent of a shareholding. Massive difference. With voting you are restricted to what you can do, with a full shareholding you can pass special resolutions without the support of other shareholders. |  | | |
| Another 3 million invested on 15:57 - Apr 20 with 1017 views | ReslovenSwan1 |
| Another 3 million invested on 13:51 - Apr 20 by Whiterockin |
I think you will find that voting rights does not give you the legal equivalent of a shareholding. Massive difference. With voting you are restricted to what you can do, with a full shareholding you can pass special resolutions without the support of other shareholders. |
Can you explain this please.
Are you saying if you buy the voting rights and not the share they are not so valuable legally as if you bought the equivalent shares?
a) K&L. 76,% shares more legal right compared with
b) K&L 69% shares and 7% bought voting rights only. | |
| Wise sage since Toshack era |
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| Another 3 million invested on 16:41 - Apr 20 with 984 views | SullutaCreturned |
| Another 3 million invested on 15:57 - Apr 20 by ReslovenSwan1 |
Can you explain this please.
Are you saying if you buy the voting rights and not the share they are not so valuable legally as if you bought the equivalent shares?
a) K&L. 76,% shares more legal right compared with
b) K&L 69% shares and 7% bought voting rights only. |
Short answer, yes.
Having a voting proxy doesn't give you the same rights as owning the shares. | | | |
| Another 3 million invested on 19:42 - Apr 20 with 903 views | ReslovenSwan1 |
| Another 3 million invested on 16:41 - Apr 20 by SullutaCreturned |
Short answer, yes.
Having a voting proxy doesn't give you the same rights as owning the shares. |
This is pretty obvious actually. The voting right do not give you a right to benefit from dividends for example. My question was "legal" rights not rights in general .
This is a very important nuance and the wording is very important.
One question is -
is the 5% protected shares only applied to "voting rights" or things like 'dividends' and full payment value at the same selling price as all other shares the club (at the point of the club sale?. [Post edited 20 Apr 20:07]
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| Wise sage since Toshack era |
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| Another 3 million invested on 22:26 - Apr 20 with 808 views | QJumpingJack |
| Another 3 million invested on 21:59 - Apr 20 by ReslovenSwan1 |
I thought you knew something i did not know and you did not.
I asked what "legal rights" were different. You came back and said yes "rights" are different (not "legal rights").
Owning voting rights does not allow you to have a dividend for example. That is obvious. I do not go in for patronising people. However if they have acted stupidly i will say so.
I pointed out again the the fans the 5% protection the Trust have needs a close looking at. It looks like once they have 5% holding when there is new investment the other shareholders will buy shares for them for free to maintain their holding %. It seems too good to be true.
WR is promoting the idea the LLC is pushing to get to 75% holding so it can push through plans that are not popular with d fans and other shareholders. It seems that they alway had voting rights for over 75% until Morris invested.
WR cut and pasted a lot of stuff but did not highlight anything to support his case. Morris is not concerned about his dilution. He could easily avoid it with a small investment to match fund. When you own a property you know you have to do maintenance. [Post edited 20 Apr 22:04]
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how an earth do you know how Morris is feeling?
Do you know him or have dealings with him and he has told you how he is feeling? | | | |
| Another 3 million invested on 22:46 - Apr 20 with 775 views | ReslovenSwan1 |
| Another 3 million invested on 22:26 - Apr 20 by QJumpingJack |
how an earth do you know how Morris is feeling?
Do you know him or have dealings with him and he has told you how he is feeling? |
Morris has bought shares in a money losing football team that has not been playing particularly well. The new investment will not have come as a surprise to him at all. If he was concerned about his % holding he would have invested himself.
Neither he nor the Trust are too worried by it. Notionally their cash valuation has not changed. If the £3m is used to buy players like Tymon and Ronald he will be happy.
I am a shareholder myself so i have a little knowledge of how shareholders think. I would not touch football with a barge pole. If my shares were diluted it would not bother me at all. The issue for me was not my percentage holding but the share valuation which depends the success or failure of the company as a whole.
I remind you this is a forum for people to give their opinions. A simple statement of facts is as dull as dishwater. I go to Newsnow Swansea for that. | |
| Wise sage since Toshack era |
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| Another 3 million invested on 22:55 - Apr 20 with 767 views | QJumpingJack |
| Another 3 million invested on 22:46 - Apr 20 by ReslovenSwan1 |
Morris has bought shares in a money losing football team that has not been playing particularly well. The new investment will not have come as a surprise to him at all. If he was concerned about his % holding he would have invested himself.
Neither he nor the Trust are too worried by it. Notionally their cash valuation has not changed. If the £3m is used to buy players like Tymon and Ronald he will be happy.
I am a shareholder myself so i have a little knowledge of how shareholders think. I would not touch football with a barge pole. If my shares were diluted it would not bother me at all. The issue for me was not my percentage holding but the share valuation which depends the success or failure of the company as a whole.
I remind you this is a forum for people to give their opinions. A simple statement of facts is as dull as dishwater. I go to Newsnow Swansea for that. |
Quote "Morris is not concerned about dilution"
That is written as fact not as an opinion. Maybe if had written "I believe" at the start it would be less confusing as it does appear you are writing on behalf of Morris. | | | |
| Another 3 million invested on 23:05 - Apr 20 with 751 views | ReslovenSwan1 |
| Another 3 million invested on 22:55 - Apr 20 by QJumpingJack |
Quote "Morris is not concerned about dilution"
That is written as fact not as an opinion. Maybe if had written "I believe" at the start it would be less confusing as it does appear you are writing on behalf of Morris. |
All my view stated on here are opinions. I have stated several times I not a club insider and and know no one at the club. I will make this statement on my moniker.
I even went to the effort of explaining why he (in my opinion) is not concerned about dilution. I drew the analogy of maintenance of a jointly owned building.
This is partly why i dislike the Trust so much. They took the money when life was good but have gone missing when the boiler needs fixing, [Post edited 20 Apr 23:13]
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| Wise sage since Toshack era |
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| Another 3 million invested on 11:53 - Apr 21 with 646 views | SullutaCreturned |
| Another 3 million invested on 22:46 - Apr 20 by ReslovenSwan1 |
Morris has bought shares in a money losing football team that has not been playing particularly well. The new investment will not have come as a surprise to him at all. If he was concerned about his % holding he would have invested himself.
Neither he nor the Trust are too worried by it. Notionally their cash valuation has not changed. If the £3m is used to buy players like Tymon and Ronald he will be happy.
I am a shareholder myself so i have a little knowledge of how shareholders think. I would not touch football with a barge pole. If my shares were diluted it would not bother me at all. The issue for me was not my percentage holding but the share valuation which depends the success or failure of the company as a whole.
I remind you this is a forum for people to give their opinions. A simple statement of facts is as dull as dishwater. I go to Newsnow Swansea for that. |
If you own a percentage of shares at a price then your percentage is diluted, lessened, then you will have lost cash value unless the share price has increased.
Has SCFC plc increased in value?
You being a shareholder means you know how you think but you cannot know with certainty how Morris thinks, nor how other shareholders think. As the rest of that paragraph proves because you would not touch football yet Morris and others do.
Facts can be dull but not anywhere near as dull as making things up and presenting them as if they are facts. We call that lying. Shared opinions can be dull too. I'm sure many of my opinions have been considered dull but I dont try to oretend I know what others are thinking.
Facts along with opinions is what we should post, not opinions dressed up as facts | | | |
| Another 3 million invested on 12:21 - Apr 21 with 642 views | whiterock |
| Another 3 million invested on 15:55 - Apr 19 by Whiterockin |
£20M since last summer. As I have said previously. If they didn't make so many expensive cock ups, particularly signings, they wouldn't have to pump so much in. [Post edited 19 Apr 15:57]
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Probably would though, the owner of Preston said it costs roughy £24 million to run a mid table championship side, revenue brings in £12m, so each year he and his family have to find £12m.
Swans are a similar sized club give or take so unless we get a Flynn Downes or Joel to sell every season we are swimming against the tide. | | | |
| Another 3 million invested on 13:24 - Apr 21 with 631 views | QJumpingJack |
| Another 3 million invested on 23:05 - Apr 20 by ReslovenSwan1 |
All my view stated on here are opinions. I have stated several times I not a club insider and and know no one at the club. I will make this statement on my moniker.
I even went to the effort of explaining why he (in my opinion) is not concerned about dilution. I drew the analogy of maintenance of a jointly owned building.
This is partly why i dislike the Trust so much. They took the money when life was good but have gone missing when the boiler needs fixing, [Post edited 20 Apr 23:13]
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If I were Nigel or his lawyer I would not be happy on the style of your posting about him. Opinions and facts getting muddled. | | | |
| Another 3 million invested on 13:35 - Apr 21 with 614 views | Whiterockin |
| Another 3 million invested on 12:21 - Apr 21 by whiterock |
Probably would though, the owner of Preston said it costs roughy £24 million to run a mid table championship side, revenue brings in £12m, so each year he and his family have to find £12m.
Swans are a similar sized club give or take so unless we get a Flynn Downes or Joel to sell every season we are swimming against the tide. |
I'm not disputing that. But obviously if you waste money you need to invest more to cover those losses on top of your normal running costs. Basic finances really. | | | |
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