| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 18:04 - Jul 27 with 4281 views | simmo |
I'm still not over that dinner. Poking at a pastry parcel wondering what it is or why it's there. Cheese was the answer, molten hot and strong as a bull. Take me back. |  |
| ask Beavis I get nothing Butthead |
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| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 20:52 - Jul 27 with 3932 views | terryb |
Cheers Clive. Awaydays is always my favourite read.
And a big thank you to your Rugby League team for their performance yesterday. I thought Wakefield had given them a present of a place in the play offs & they then returned the favour!
Both teams remind me of Rangers when we come close to challenging the play off spots. Give the supporters some hope & then return to normality. |  | | |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 20:55 - Jul 27 with 3913 views | Northernr |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 20:52 - Jul 27 by terryb |
Cheers Clive. Awaydays is always my favourite read.
And a big thank you to your Rugby League team for their performance yesterday. I thought Wakefield had given them a present of a place in the play offs & they then returned the favour!
Both teams remind me of Rangers when we come close to challenging the play off spots. Give the supporters some hope & then return to normality. |
Very Hull FC to record their biggest win at Wigan in 30 years then come home and lose to fcking Huddersfield. |  | | |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 06:39 - Jul 28 with 3278 views | Rsole |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 18:04 - Jul 27 by simmo |
I'm still not over that dinner. Poking at a pastry parcel wondering what it is or why it's there. Cheese was the answer, molten hot and strong as a bull. Take me back. |
Chateauneuf du Pape, Rodney ! |  |
| Those possessed by devils, try and keep them under control a bit, can't you ?
|
| |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 06:46 - Jul 28 with 3267 views | Rsole |
Great stuff. Your observations on France are spot on.
I’ll never forget the conversation we had with the local stables one year.
Suspecting they were closed, we called regardless - just in case.
‘Are you open ?’
‘But of course !’
‘Great, can we book a lesson this week ?’
‘Certainly not’
‘Why not ?’
‘Well, we are working BUT the horses, zey are on holidays !’
Seeking an alternative, we drove to Narbonne but they decided to close the motorway near Carcassone because a massive Vulture was camped out on the central reservation. | |
| Those possessed by devils, try and keep them under control a bit, can't you ?
|
| |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 07:31 - Jul 28 with 3214 views | thehat |
Very happy Clive's articles are back from the summer break. One of life's small remaining pleasures is reading these masterpieces in bed and as always this one didn't disappoint.
I have not watched any of the pre season friendlies but am already starting to feel a tad nervous.
Walsh over Nardi - WTF | | | |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 07:56 - Jul 28 with 3162 views | derbyhoop |
Now, as a French resident, I found myself spitting out my coffee over the descriptions of French cuisine. I don't think any of the UK food magazines will be calling you to review their chosen restaurants, if you're going to be flippant.
And, needless to say, there are rules as to which nouns are masculine and which feminine. But, of course, there are exceptions. Only in France  |  |
| "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one's lifetime." (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop and now on Bluesky |
| |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 09:13 - Jul 28 with 2990 views | Rsole |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 07:56 - Jul 28 by derbyhoop |
Now, as a French resident, I found myself spitting out my coffee over the descriptions of French cuisine. I don't think any of the UK food magazines will be calling you to review their chosen restaurants, if you're going to be flippant.
And, needless to say, there are rules as to which nouns are masculine and which feminine. But, of course, there are exceptions. Only in France |
I was a little surprised that the fore-mentioned Vulture had not been served up for lunch the next day. As in China, anything with wings is fair game - apart from aeroplanes. | |
| Those possessed by devils, try and keep them under control a bit, can't you ?
|
| |
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| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 09:46 - Jul 28 with 2924 views | TheChef |
Great stuff Clive.
Something about the Mediterranean countries, happy to riot/kick off at a moment's notice but love bureaucracy and paperwork for every minute thing. Same for Italy, and I think Spain to an extent. |  |
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| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 14:13 - Jul 28 with 2461 views | Beans |
When you say, “Social media has drunk the Kool-Aid, Cifuentes is a snake who was never that good in the first place, but that’s not the prevailing attitude among the travellers I’ve interacted with this summer. You sack a popular manager doing his job, and the expectation that places on you is you’ve got to improve and get better. Among the home and awayers there’s a deal of arm folding and “go on then”, whereas before there was understanding about budgetary restrictions”
That really irritates me and IIfind it so bizarre that you push a narrative that Cifuentes was an innocent party who was forced out of the club and sacked because surely you know that isn’t true. As you know that what the club did was take steps to protect their rights to compensation and they succeeded in that and got £500,000 plus what ever we got for Xavi Calm on top.
Did you not see the story in the Sun where Cifuentes suggested he may quit? Did you not see WLS reporting that the clubs steps were taken to protect our rights to compensation which they were successful in? Do you really believe WLS are wrong in their reporting and that Cifuentes wasn’t looking to drive down or get rid of entirely the compensation fee we would be owed this summer with a list of jobs for him to pitch himself, Norwich, West Brom and then Leicester. Because if not, why present it here as “You sack a popular manager doing his job”?
You say the difference is between social media and the home and awayers. But what you’ve left out there is it’s largely also a difference between those that go on this message board and those that don’t. It’s a common trope for people to complain that papers like the Daily Mail feed Boomers bad opinions and ultimately you are doing exactly the same thing here. As someone reading an article of yours like this one here might have the opinion that Cifuentes was an innocent party who was forced out by Nourry and not someone acting in his own best interests and maximising his chances of moving to a bigger club with a bigger budget.
For you to persistently spin Cifuentes leaving as a one sided story “sacking a popular manager doing his job” and leave out the other side to tee up a section of the fan base to be itching to jump on the team if it doesn’t get better than it was (which was 2 wins in Cifuentes last 12) well I think it’s just pretty awful really. We saw last season culminating in the Stoke how important it is for the fan base to stick with the team.
The reason all this irritates me is because it can ultimately cost the club and it is based on a false premise that Cifuentes is an innocent party who would otherwise still be here if we hadn’t put him in the garden.
We are the club with what Nourry said on the WLS podcast last week the third smallest wage bill. And you have said yourself the league table is largely a reflection of wage bill. So if a section of the fan base are waiting for things to go wrong (as we know for some run of games this season they will) so they can pill on and turn things toxic and potentially contribute to instability that costs us points this season. That could send us down as with the third smallest wage bill we can’t afford as a fan base to needlessly contribute to instability. We can be looking backwards at a manager based on a false narrative and who anyway is now at a parachute payment club.
We need to stick together. We are one of the smallest budgets this season. We are unfancied. The league one clubs are coming up even and spending fortunes. We need to back the team and not be looking to cry off about Cifuentes when we lose a couple of games. Please stop pushing this false narrative. Cifuentes is gone and he was never going to be here for this season. Let’s back the team. We’ve got a job on our hands and let’s not needlessly destabilise things | | | |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 14:18 - Jul 28 with 2427 views | Northernr |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 14:13 - Jul 28 by Beans |
When you say, “Social media has drunk the Kool-Aid, Cifuentes is a snake who was never that good in the first place, but that’s not the prevailing attitude among the travellers I’ve interacted with this summer. You sack a popular manager doing his job, and the expectation that places on you is you’ve got to improve and get better. Among the home and awayers there’s a deal of arm folding and “go on then”, whereas before there was understanding about budgetary restrictions”
That really irritates me and IIfind it so bizarre that you push a narrative that Cifuentes was an innocent party who was forced out of the club and sacked because surely you know that isn’t true. As you know that what the club did was take steps to protect their rights to compensation and they succeeded in that and got £500,000 plus what ever we got for Xavi Calm on top.
Did you not see the story in the Sun where Cifuentes suggested he may quit? Did you not see WLS reporting that the clubs steps were taken to protect our rights to compensation which they were successful in? Do you really believe WLS are wrong in their reporting and that Cifuentes wasn’t looking to drive down or get rid of entirely the compensation fee we would be owed this summer with a list of jobs for him to pitch himself, Norwich, West Brom and then Leicester. Because if not, why present it here as “You sack a popular manager doing his job”?
You say the difference is between social media and the home and awayers. But what you’ve left out there is it’s largely also a difference between those that go on this message board and those that don’t. It’s a common trope for people to complain that papers like the Daily Mail feed Boomers bad opinions and ultimately you are doing exactly the same thing here. As someone reading an article of yours like this one here might have the opinion that Cifuentes was an innocent party who was forced out by Nourry and not someone acting in his own best interests and maximising his chances of moving to a bigger club with a bigger budget.
For you to persistently spin Cifuentes leaving as a one sided story “sacking a popular manager doing his job” and leave out the other side to tee up a section of the fan base to be itching to jump on the team if it doesn’t get better than it was (which was 2 wins in Cifuentes last 12) well I think it’s just pretty awful really. We saw last season culminating in the Stoke how important it is for the fan base to stick with the team.
The reason all this irritates me is because it can ultimately cost the club and it is based on a false premise that Cifuentes is an innocent party who would otherwise still be here if we hadn’t put him in the garden.
We are the club with what Nourry said on the WLS podcast last week the third smallest wage bill. And you have said yourself the league table is largely a reflection of wage bill. So if a section of the fan base are waiting for things to go wrong (as we know for some run of games this season they will) so they can pill on and turn things toxic and potentially contribute to instability that costs us points this season. That could send us down as with the third smallest wage bill we can’t afford as a fan base to needlessly contribute to instability. We can be looking backwards at a manager based on a false narrative and who anyway is now at a parachute payment club.
We need to stick together. We are one of the smallest budgets this season. We are unfancied. The league one clubs are coming up even and spending fortunes. We need to back the team and not be looking to cry off about Cifuentes when we lose a couple of games. Please stop pushing this false narrative. Cifuentes is gone and he was never going to be here for this season. Let’s back the team. We’ve got a job on our hands and let’s not needlessly destabilise things |
Are you actually talking to me this time? | | | |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 14:23 - Jul 28 with 2383 views | robith |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 14:13 - Jul 28 by Beans |
When you say, “Social media has drunk the Kool-Aid, Cifuentes is a snake who was never that good in the first place, but that’s not the prevailing attitude among the travellers I’ve interacted with this summer. You sack a popular manager doing his job, and the expectation that places on you is you’ve got to improve and get better. Among the home and awayers there’s a deal of arm folding and “go on then”, whereas before there was understanding about budgetary restrictions”
That really irritates me and IIfind it so bizarre that you push a narrative that Cifuentes was an innocent party who was forced out of the club and sacked because surely you know that isn’t true. As you know that what the club did was take steps to protect their rights to compensation and they succeeded in that and got £500,000 plus what ever we got for Xavi Calm on top.
Did you not see the story in the Sun where Cifuentes suggested he may quit? Did you not see WLS reporting that the clubs steps were taken to protect our rights to compensation which they were successful in? Do you really believe WLS are wrong in their reporting and that Cifuentes wasn’t looking to drive down or get rid of entirely the compensation fee we would be owed this summer with a list of jobs for him to pitch himself, Norwich, West Brom and then Leicester. Because if not, why present it here as “You sack a popular manager doing his job”?
You say the difference is between social media and the home and awayers. But what you’ve left out there is it’s largely also a difference between those that go on this message board and those that don’t. It’s a common trope for people to complain that papers like the Daily Mail feed Boomers bad opinions and ultimately you are doing exactly the same thing here. As someone reading an article of yours like this one here might have the opinion that Cifuentes was an innocent party who was forced out by Nourry and not someone acting in his own best interests and maximising his chances of moving to a bigger club with a bigger budget.
For you to persistently spin Cifuentes leaving as a one sided story “sacking a popular manager doing his job” and leave out the other side to tee up a section of the fan base to be itching to jump on the team if it doesn’t get better than it was (which was 2 wins in Cifuentes last 12) well I think it’s just pretty awful really. We saw last season culminating in the Stoke how important it is for the fan base to stick with the team.
The reason all this irritates me is because it can ultimately cost the club and it is based on a false premise that Cifuentes is an innocent party who would otherwise still be here if we hadn’t put him in the garden.
We are the club with what Nourry said on the WLS podcast last week the third smallest wage bill. And you have said yourself the league table is largely a reflection of wage bill. So if a section of the fan base are waiting for things to go wrong (as we know for some run of games this season they will) so they can pill on and turn things toxic and potentially contribute to instability that costs us points this season. That could send us down as with the third smallest wage bill we can’t afford as a fan base to needlessly contribute to instability. We can be looking backwards at a manager based on a false narrative and who anyway is now at a parachute payment club.
We need to stick together. We are one of the smallest budgets this season. We are unfancied. The league one clubs are coming up even and spending fortunes. We need to back the team and not be looking to cry off about Cifuentes when we lose a couple of games. Please stop pushing this false narrative. Cifuentes is gone and he was never going to be here for this season. Let’s back the team. We’ve got a job on our hands and let’s not needlessly destabilise things |
 |  | | |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 14:47 - Jul 28 with 2308 views | TheChef |
Yay Beans is back!
Nice holiday? | |
| |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 16:05 - Jul 28 with 2159 views | Beans |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 14:18 - Jul 28 by Northernr |
Are you actually talking to me this time? |
I am yeah.
There is plenty of legitimate things to moan about with this club so think it’s not helpful for you to go around inventing fictional ones [Post edited 28 Jul 16:06]
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| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 16:08 - Jul 28 with 2148 views | eastside_r |
@Beans.
So please enlighten us exactly what Marti did (wrong), so that we can form our own opinion.
As you are definitely not Christian Nourry or a representative of the club you won't be breaking any confidentially agreement because this would just be message-board bantz / speculation between fellow supporters.
Please tell us what you know. |  | | |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 16:20 - Jul 28 with 2096 views | NewYorkRanger |
Blimey - that's quite a reaction to what I saw as a throwaway line in an enjoyable and mostly lighthearted article.
Someone rattled Beans' cage today? |  |
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| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 16:25 - Jul 28 with 2068 views | Rsole |
Who are you, who who, who who ?
 | |
| Those possessed by devils, try and keep them under control a bit, can't you ?
|
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| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 17:11 - Jul 28 with 1881 views | slmrstid |
Who said our Christian was insecure?
Beans Beans, the musical fruit,
The more you eat the more you toot. |  | | |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 17:16 - Jul 28 with 1855 views | Northernr |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 16:05 - Jul 28 by Beans |
I am yeah.
There is plenty of legitimate things to moan about with this club so think it’s not helpful for you to go around inventing fictional ones [Post edited 28 Jul 16:06]
|
Well at the risk of making you look daft again - and let's just take a step back and acknowledge how hilarious that response in the context of what is mainly a mildly amusing colour piece about how the French eat - I'll make a couple of points.
1 - If you want cheerleading and party lines toed, the club has an official website for that. It's here...
https://www.qpr.co.uk/
2 - There are many jobs of this site - online forum meeting place for QPR, community, decent technical analysis from people like Greg, comedy and colour pieces, reflecting fan life back at fans, match reports for expats, debate, emotional support in tough times - but also to be a critical friend of the club. This site has lasted as long as it has, and in fact grown at a time when print media, written media, long form journalism and forums are collapsing everywhere else, because, while I may not always be right, I'm always authentic and honest. I'll also hold my hands up the frequent times I'm wrong. You may not like that line (in a 3,500 word piece BTW), but I went to Perpignan last week and I spoke to people who were there and whether you like it or not that was a prevailing attitude among many. It's a challenge the club and the new manager will face this year, however fair or unfair that is on them and him. Now it may cost me access or whatever, but I don't care, I care about being authentic to the audience of this site.
3 - I really, really don't care what the various anonymous accounts who've appeared on this site over the last 6-12 months all parroting exactly the same lines, some of them not even arsed to type them out themselves and getting AI to do it instead, think of me or my output. Joe Hylton comes up to me in Crown, Dave Thomas comes up to me in an away end, Brian McCarthy rings me up, Dave Mc gets in my ear and says "not sure about that one mate" I'll sit up and listen. But if I'm irritating you as much as this I'll take that as an indication I'm doing my job pretty well.
4 - It's noticeable how quickly any mention of Cifuentes is now quickly hit with "history, gone, wasn't that good in the first place, move on" and any mild concern about the team is met with "can't you be positive, why don't you support the club". That's another throwback to the Paladini days - if you spoke negatively or expressed concern you weren't a "real fan". It's bolox. | | | |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 17:32 - Jul 28 with 1774 views | Rangersw12 |
One of the best away days ever
Beautiful setting, lovely food and loads of drinks .
I'm hoping the club go somewhere similar next season | | | |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 17:41 - Jul 28 with 1734 views | Stainrod |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 14:13 - Jul 28 by Beans |
When you say, “Social media has drunk the Kool-Aid, Cifuentes is a snake who was never that good in the first place, but that’s not the prevailing attitude among the travellers I’ve interacted with this summer. You sack a popular manager doing his job, and the expectation that places on you is you’ve got to improve and get better. Among the home and awayers there’s a deal of arm folding and “go on then”, whereas before there was understanding about budgetary restrictions”
That really irritates me and IIfind it so bizarre that you push a narrative that Cifuentes was an innocent party who was forced out of the club and sacked because surely you know that isn’t true. As you know that what the club did was take steps to protect their rights to compensation and they succeeded in that and got £500,000 plus what ever we got for Xavi Calm on top.
Did you not see the story in the Sun where Cifuentes suggested he may quit? Did you not see WLS reporting that the clubs steps were taken to protect our rights to compensation which they were successful in? Do you really believe WLS are wrong in their reporting and that Cifuentes wasn’t looking to drive down or get rid of entirely the compensation fee we would be owed this summer with a list of jobs for him to pitch himself, Norwich, West Brom and then Leicester. Because if not, why present it here as “You sack a popular manager doing his job”?
You say the difference is between social media and the home and awayers. But what you’ve left out there is it’s largely also a difference between those that go on this message board and those that don’t. It’s a common trope for people to complain that papers like the Daily Mail feed Boomers bad opinions and ultimately you are doing exactly the same thing here. As someone reading an article of yours like this one here might have the opinion that Cifuentes was an innocent party who was forced out by Nourry and not someone acting in his own best interests and maximising his chances of moving to a bigger club with a bigger budget.
For you to persistently spin Cifuentes leaving as a one sided story “sacking a popular manager doing his job” and leave out the other side to tee up a section of the fan base to be itching to jump on the team if it doesn’t get better than it was (which was 2 wins in Cifuentes last 12) well I think it’s just pretty awful really. We saw last season culminating in the Stoke how important it is for the fan base to stick with the team.
The reason all this irritates me is because it can ultimately cost the club and it is based on a false premise that Cifuentes is an innocent party who would otherwise still be here if we hadn’t put him in the garden.
We are the club with what Nourry said on the WLS podcast last week the third smallest wage bill. And you have said yourself the league table is largely a reflection of wage bill. So if a section of the fan base are waiting for things to go wrong (as we know for some run of games this season they will) so they can pill on and turn things toxic and potentially contribute to instability that costs us points this season. That could send us down as with the third smallest wage bill we can’t afford as a fan base to needlessly contribute to instability. We can be looking backwards at a manager based on a false narrative and who anyway is now at a parachute payment club.
We need to stick together. We are one of the smallest budgets this season. We are unfancied. The league one clubs are coming up even and spending fortunes. We need to back the team and not be looking to cry off about Cifuentes when we lose a couple of games. Please stop pushing this false narrative. Cifuentes is gone and he was never going to be here for this season. Let’s back the team. We’ve got a job on our hands and let’s not needlessly destabilise things |
My reading of the original piece, for what it is worth, was simply that Nourry has placed a bit of added pressure on himself (regardless of where responsibility primarily sits for Marti's departure). I made similar comments myself during the stand off, and IF Nourry did not reflect on that himself he was a little naive.
I don't follow the team away btw but I have very similar views to those expressed by Clive here. Under Marti there was a togetherness (I felt) among the fanbase and a remarkable resilience. But rightly or wrongly many will interpret some of the briefing against Marti as the board not being satisfied with where we finished last season. Stephan is 100% Nourry's guy; if he succeeds Nourry will get plaudits, if he doesn't, well its naturally going to dredge up some Marti questions (namely why was he so pissed off that he told the Sun he might leave, and was there more the club could have done to reach a compromise?).
Given the injuries and the squad Marti was given (and the budget, as you say) I think it was at worst a par round that Marti delivered last season. But if the briefing coming out of the club was all "we should really have finished higher, the injuries were no worse than average for the division, we should have played even more youth players and stayed in the Championship, we need a manager who understand 3 game a week football culture" etc etc, then the attitude of many fans to Nourry is surely going to be: "given you have now addressed the issues you identified, Nourry/ Stephan should be able to deliver at worst a top half finish."
Stephan is very much Nourry's manager; the squad is now largely his; this is his train set, and he will be judged according to how well it does this season.
For the record I actually think he has done pretty well, the Kelman sale the latest example. But as time goes on, and he continues his root and branch reform of the club, the record inevitably comes under scrutiny as with any CEO.
BTW, as someone whose job is communications, my professional advice would be: show a little humility. As a fanbase we are actually pretty forgiving and most thoughtful fans recognise its a bloody hard job. We also realise Nourry is young. Being big enough to admit he has made some mistakes but learnt from them would certainly impress me, and show a willingness to learn and improve that seemed beyond Hoos. [Post edited 28 Jul 17:44]
| | | |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 18:38 - Jul 28 with 1586 views | Beans |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 17:16 - Jul 28 by Northernr |
Well at the risk of making you look daft again - and let's just take a step back and acknowledge how hilarious that response in the context of what is mainly a mildly amusing colour piece about how the French eat - I'll make a couple of points.
1 - If you want cheerleading and party lines toed, the club has an official website for that. It's here...
https://www.qpr.co.uk/
2 - There are many jobs of this site - online forum meeting place for QPR, community, decent technical analysis from people like Greg, comedy and colour pieces, reflecting fan life back at fans, match reports for expats, debate, emotional support in tough times - but also to be a critical friend of the club. This site has lasted as long as it has, and in fact grown at a time when print media, written media, long form journalism and forums are collapsing everywhere else, because, while I may not always be right, I'm always authentic and honest. I'll also hold my hands up the frequent times I'm wrong. You may not like that line (in a 3,500 word piece BTW), but I went to Perpignan last week and I spoke to people who were there and whether you like it or not that was a prevailing attitude among many. It's a challenge the club and the new manager will face this year, however fair or unfair that is on them and him. Now it may cost me access or whatever, but I don't care, I care about being authentic to the audience of this site.
3 - I really, really don't care what the various anonymous accounts who've appeared on this site over the last 6-12 months all parroting exactly the same lines, some of them not even arsed to type them out themselves and getting AI to do it instead, think of me or my output. Joe Hylton comes up to me in Crown, Dave Thomas comes up to me in an away end, Brian McCarthy rings me up, Dave Mc gets in my ear and says "not sure about that one mate" I'll sit up and listen. But if I'm irritating you as much as this I'll take that as an indication I'm doing my job pretty well.
4 - It's noticeable how quickly any mention of Cifuentes is now quickly hit with "history, gone, wasn't that good in the first place, move on" and any mild concern about the team is met with "can't you be positive, why don't you support the club". That's another throwback to the Paladini days - if you spoke negatively or expressed concern you weren't a "real fan". It's bolox. |
You’re obfuscating. Going off on a tangent as normal to get away from the point at hand. Let’s look at your four points briefly that you tried to get away from the topic on before reverting back to what I actually raised.
1) club site bit. Clearly silly. As I said, legitimate criticism of course all for it but making stuff up is what I have taken issue with
2) entirely irrelevant points raised by you. None of them address the specific point being made here about you pushing a false narrative about how Cifuentes left the club
3) you making a point that you can only see truth from a circle of 4 people and anything outside of that you instantly dismiss seems an oddly and close minded stance. To then add that saying if you annoy people outside of these 4 then that’s it’s evidence you are doing your job well is an even stranger point to make
4) would say let’s see if any of that’s a fair comment by having a look at that in the context of the point being made
The paragraph being focused on in your article was:
“Social media has drunk the Kool-Aid, Cifuentes is a snake who was never that good in the first place, but that’s not the prevailing attitude among the travellers I’ve interacted with this summer. You sack a popular manager doing his job, and the expectation that places on you is you’ve got to improve and get better. Among the home and awayers there’s a deal of arm folding and “go on then”, whereas before there was understanding about budgetary rest”
For you now to present this as you just echoing other people’s opinion as if this isn’t actually your own opinion isn’t something I believe. I would say it fits with the stance you have presented consistently since Cifuentes left
You begin the paragraph with an insinuation that if you aren’t still sore about Marti moving on and a new manager being here then you have “drunk the Kool Aid”. Now to stop on this point for a second to explain myself and why this bothers me is that I think people on this board like Rsole as a good example are like the Boomers reading the Daily Mail I referred to being fed bad opinions. Someone like Rsole reads that KoolAid statement as a signal that the in group opinion is to be unhappy about it still and it important to dwell on in a negative way so that you haven’t “drunk the KoolAid”: so to reinforce that Rsole just pipes in with an insult, without adding anything useful to the debate here so he can signal to the group he follows the accepted view point on here. Others a less vocal but the point remains the same they read that and are influenced to take on a certain belief
You go on to present the opposing view as, “You sack a popular manager doing his job, and the expectation that places on you is you’ve got to improve and get better” and you frame this in the context of it being the belief of the home and awayers which is a more positive group to be seen in by those that care, most obviously the likes of Rsole care but it’s natural for others to absorb this info just like a boomer reading the Daily Mail.
Now this would all be fine, if it were true and Marti was an innocent victim and if he had it his way he would still be here is just silly. This position of yours I thought had ended with the Leicester deal but still now you are trying to push this narrative even if now your tactic is to dress it up as the opinion of the in group.
I am all for challenging the club over genuine mistakes. I agree it’s a fair concern about us being more open in midfield and Walsh coming in for Nardi. But I am not for you reinforcing a myth that Marti was an innocent party and not acting in his own interests against the clubs to get a move as he did
If you could address that point was Marti an innocent party as you so often present, or you could just go off on a tangent and start talking about things other posters said over the last 6-12 months you disagreed with instead | | | |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 18:53 - Jul 28 with 1523 views | thehat |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 18:38 - Jul 28 by Beans |
You’re obfuscating. Going off on a tangent as normal to get away from the point at hand. Let’s look at your four points briefly that you tried to get away from the topic on before reverting back to what I actually raised.
1) club site bit. Clearly silly. As I said, legitimate criticism of course all for it but making stuff up is what I have taken issue with
2) entirely irrelevant points raised by you. None of them address the specific point being made here about you pushing a false narrative about how Cifuentes left the club
3) you making a point that you can only see truth from a circle of 4 people and anything outside of that you instantly dismiss seems an oddly and close minded stance. To then add that saying if you annoy people outside of these 4 then that’s it’s evidence you are doing your job well is an even stranger point to make
4) would say let’s see if any of that’s a fair comment by having a look at that in the context of the point being made
The paragraph being focused on in your article was:
“Social media has drunk the Kool-Aid, Cifuentes is a snake who was never that good in the first place, but that’s not the prevailing attitude among the travellers I’ve interacted with this summer. You sack a popular manager doing his job, and the expectation that places on you is you’ve got to improve and get better. Among the home and awayers there’s a deal of arm folding and “go on then”, whereas before there was understanding about budgetary rest”
For you now to present this as you just echoing other people’s opinion as if this isn’t actually your own opinion isn’t something I believe. I would say it fits with the stance you have presented consistently since Cifuentes left
You begin the paragraph with an insinuation that if you aren’t still sore about Marti moving on and a new manager being here then you have “drunk the Kool Aid”. Now to stop on this point for a second to explain myself and why this bothers me is that I think people on this board like Rsole as a good example are like the Boomers reading the Daily Mail I referred to being fed bad opinions. Someone like Rsole reads that KoolAid statement as a signal that the in group opinion is to be unhappy about it still and it important to dwell on in a negative way so that you haven’t “drunk the KoolAid”: so to reinforce that Rsole just pipes in with an insult, without adding anything useful to the debate here so he can signal to the group he follows the accepted view point on here. Others a less vocal but the point remains the same they read that and are influenced to take on a certain belief
You go on to present the opposing view as, “You sack a popular manager doing his job, and the expectation that places on you is you’ve got to improve and get better” and you frame this in the context of it being the belief of the home and awayers which is a more positive group to be seen in by those that care, most obviously the likes of Rsole care but it’s natural for others to absorb this info just like a boomer reading the Daily Mail.
Now this would all be fine, if it were true and Marti was an innocent victim and if he had it his way he would still be here is just silly. This position of yours I thought had ended with the Leicester deal but still now you are trying to push this narrative even if now your tactic is to dress it up as the opinion of the in group.
I am all for challenging the club over genuine mistakes. I agree it’s a fair concern about us being more open in midfield and Walsh coming in for Nardi. But I am not for you reinforcing a myth that Marti was an innocent party and not acting in his own interests against the clubs to get a move as he did
If you could address that point was Marti an innocent party as you so often present, or you could just go off on a tangent and start talking about things other posters said over the last 6-12 months you disagreed with instead |
Beans - Clive writes hundreds of articles that we all enjoy reading.
No need to forensically dissect every paragraph and get to deep.
Surely you must have better things to do. | | | |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 18:55 - Jul 28 with 1515 views | Quite_Possibly_Ropey |
This is starting to read like a thesis someone is working on. Or playing the man and not the ball. Or getting a poll started up.
For what it's worth I'm a home and awayer but sadly wasn't in Perpignan - and this does indeed reflect my opinion. Fully behind Stephan but loved Marti for the job he did in difficult circumstances. Nothing more, nothing less.
Fantastic read as well Clive. [Post edited 28 Jul 18:57]
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| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 19:09 - Jul 28 with 1447 views | Rangersw12 |
| Pre-season and Perpignan – Awaydays on 18:55 - Jul 28 by Quite_Possibly_Ropey |
This is starting to read like a thesis someone is working on. Or playing the man and not the ball. Or getting a poll started up.
For what it's worth I'm a home and awayer but sadly wasn't in Perpignan - and this does indeed reflect my opinion. Fully behind Stephan but loved Marti for the job he did in difficult circumstances. Nothing more, nothing less.
Fantastic read as well Clive. [Post edited 28 Jul 18:57]
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Like I said a few weeks ago this regime is reminding more and more like Paladini's .
12 months ago we were all united behind a great manager who seemed to get us as a club yet you only have to look at nearly every thread on here and twitter etc how fractured this fanbase has become
I'm praying we start well as this will get messy pretty quickly otherwise | | | |
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