| Is Tone a bit distracted 18:06 - Feb 1 with 21016 views | jaffrtid |
Airbus would have been a handy sponsor |  | | |  |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 14:28 - Feb 2 with 2681 views | Benny_the_Ball |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 13:38 - Feb 2 by BazzaInTheLoft |
Mittal (and family) have had plenty of investigations themselves including Cash for Influence scandals, slave labour accusations, terrible safety record in their mines, environmental regulation breaches, and recently the arrest of Pramod Mittal (the brother) in Bosnia for irregular financial activity.
Being the mad Commie I am I would suggest that you rarely get a wealthy benefactor with good intentions as being a psychopath is the only route to being a billionaire.
If the Fit and Proper test was reformed and applied properly we would eliminate half the wronguns that own football clubs and we'd have a more level playing field.
https://www.efl.com/-more/governance/efl-rules--regulations/appendix-3---owners- [Post edited 2 Feb 2020 13:48]
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And there in lies the problem, Bazza; the foundations for true community-owned clubs simply don't exist. Unless you can reform FFP regulations, TV money, player salaries, transfer fees, academy rules, football agents, fit and proper persons testing, Champions League football, the Bosman ruling, etc. you have little chance of making a success of community ownership of a football club at our level. |  | | |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 14:36 - Feb 2 with 2650 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 14:28 - Feb 2 by Benny_the_Ball |
And there in lies the problem, Bazza; the foundations for true community-owned clubs simply don't exist. Unless you can reform FFP regulations, TV money, player salaries, transfer fees, academy rules, football agents, fit and proper persons testing, Champions League football, the Bosman ruling, etc. you have little chance of making a success of community ownership of a football club at our level. |
What is our level? Bearing in mind we have one major trophy to our name and have a 13k average attendance?
Not a dig at our support by the way, but it is what it is. [Post edited 2 Feb 2020 14:39]
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| Is Tone a bit distracted on 15:37 - Feb 2 with 2560 views | PlanetHonneywood |
I appreciate that quoting Shakespeare can cause you trouble these days, but ‘Hoisted on his own petard’ isn’t one of them!! |  |
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| Is Tone a bit distracted on 15:59 - Feb 2 with 2515 views | Hastings_Hoops |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 14:36 - Feb 2 by BazzaInTheLoft |
What is our level? Bearing in mind we have one major trophy to our name and have a 13k average attendance?
Not a dig at our support by the way, but it is what it is. [Post edited 2 Feb 2020 14:39]
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Quite enjoying QPR at this level. Would like the Premier League I’d done properly and would like good football in the Championship.
If I wanted to support a community owned club on a small budget, I would go to my local non-league club. |  | | |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 16:04 - Feb 2 with 2504 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 15:59 - Feb 2 by Hastings_Hoops |
Quite enjoying QPR at this level. Would like the Premier League I’d done properly and would like good football in the Championship.
If I wanted to support a community owned club on a small budget, I would go to my local non-league club. |
Fair enough.
If you are happy to accept zero influence over how the club is run and let psychopaths and profit minded individuals make decisions without consequence about something I presume you hold dear then maybe letting supporters have stake in QPR isn't for you. | | | |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 16:05 - Feb 2 with 2502 views | paulparker |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 14:36 - Feb 2 by BazzaInTheLoft |
What is our level? Bearing in mind we have one major trophy to our name and have a 13k average attendance?
Not a dig at our support by the way, but it is what it is. [Post edited 2 Feb 2020 14:39]
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Maybe we should ask Millwall we are bigger than them but how many play off finals , Fa cup semi finals have they been to in the last 10 years , also how come they Finnish above us every other year and they don’t have half the talent we have going forward |  |
| And Bowles is onside, Swinburne has come rushing out of his goal , what can Bowles do here , onto the left foot no, on to the right foot
That’s there that’s two, and that’s Bowles
Brian Moore
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| Is Tone a bit distracted on 16:15 - Feb 2 with 2477 views | qprd |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 11:28 - Feb 2 by BazzaInTheLoft |
AFC Wimbledon, a London club two divisions below with half our attendance are about to build a new council owned stadium and are being run fine by supporters and are in the Red as far as I know. [Post edited 2 Feb 2020 11:29]
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Its virtually impossible financially for fans to own any Championship club in today's environment, let alone QPR.
I think I heard somewhere that QPR has lost money in basically every year for the last 20 years.
Sure, the fans could theoretically chip in to buy the club.
But the club loses money every year. This would mean that in order to keep the lights on, QPR would either need to get money externally (i.e., from a bank) or the shareholders would have to invest more money.
If the former, no third party with a brain is going to lend money to QPR given its financial track record, unless they get a mortgage on the stadium. Yep, that's going to end well. If the latter, the fans aint going to be happy when they have to make additional equity contributions to keep the club from going bankrupt. You either have to continue investing to keep your stake OR you dont invest in the follow-on rounds and get diluted.
Totally and utterly unrealistic. | | | |
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| Is Tone a bit distracted on 16:23 - Feb 2 with 2439 views | Nov77 |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 14:36 - Feb 2 by BazzaInTheLoft |
What is our level? Bearing in mind we have one major trophy to our name and have a 13k average attendance?
Not a dig at our support by the way, but it is what it is. [Post edited 2 Feb 2020 14:39]
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What was Burnley, Brighton, Watford, Bournemouth’s etc level compared to ours over the last 50+ years?
Sorry, but can’t stand the ‘only a small club, can’t expect much’ mentality., if the above clubs thought like that they’d still be where we are today. |  |
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| Is Tone a bit distracted on 16:27 - Feb 2 with 2433 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 16:23 - Feb 2 by Nov77 |
What was Burnley, Brighton, Watford, Bournemouth’s etc level compared to ours over the last 50+ years?
Sorry, but can’t stand the ‘only a small club, can’t expect much’ mentality., if the above clubs thought like that they’d still be where we are today. |
You've exactly made my point.
We can be a small club financially and still be successful. We don't need a sugar daddy if we are clever. | | | |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 16:36 - Feb 2 with 2400 views | BucksRanger |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 16:27 - Feb 2 by BazzaInTheLoft |
You've exactly made my point.
We can be a small club financially and still be successful. We don't need a sugar daddy if we are clever. |
I think you're going to need lots of little sugar daddies if you want the fans to buy the club and run it.
Say 13,000 hard core fans with £10k to spare to buy the club (if you can get it that cheap) and then an on going £1k per fan per year to subsidise the club at the current level.
Good luck with that Bazza. I would actually applaud your efforts if you took on the task. I somehow suspect that deep down you know it's not a viable solution. |  | | |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 16:38 - Feb 2 with 2389 views | TGRRRSSS |
Some form of Fan Part ownership is a good idea - but I don't know how successful it ends up in the end, haven't Portsmouth Fans trust sold to the Disney bloke?
As for the ML business - it's QPR so anything is possible. |  | | |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 16:43 - Feb 2 with 2370 views | qprd |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 00:30 - Feb 2 by BazzaInTheLoft |
If you open up that Tweet the statement specified QPR as being a vehicle for laundered money. Not a clue who the source or journalist is mind. |
A little bit of information can be a dangerous thing....
The deferred prosecution agreement is publicly available, so we dont need to speculate:
https://www.sfo.gov.uk/download/airbus-se-deferred-prosecution-agreement-stateme
I havent read all of the attachments, but the DPA is silent as to the entity which received payments from Airbus. Anyone saying that this relates to Caterham or QPR is just speculating.
Having said that, you only need to do a quick google images search to confirm that Airbus did, in fact, sponsor Caterham vehicles. I am not sure if QPR was sponsored by Airbus at any time in the last few years. [Post edited 2 Feb 2020 16:54]
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| Is Tone a bit distracted on 16:45 - Feb 2 with 2369 views | QPR_John |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 16:22 - Feb 2 by BazzaInTheLoft |
We lose money because we pay players too much, even now. This is from 2018/19 so a bit out of date but the point is the same.
Look at where some of those clubs with lower wage bills are. I'm thinking specifically about Brentford and Sheffield United here by the way. We can be successful and pay low wages if we are clever about it.
[Post edited 2 Feb 2020 16:29]
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These figures are well out of date. We have removed at least £50K
per week off the wage bill this January. [Post edited 2 Feb 2020 16:57]
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| Is Tone a bit distracted on 16:59 - Feb 2 with 2330 views | Gloucs_R |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 16:45 - Feb 2 by QPR_John |
These figures are well out of date. We have removed at least £50K
per week off the wage bill this January. [Post edited 2 Feb 2020 16:57]
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And Forest spend millions more now |  |
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| Is Tone a bit distracted on 17:01 - Feb 2 with 2323 views | PunteR |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 13:15 - Feb 2 by BazzaInTheLoft |
Supporter owned, part owned, or controlled football clubs in or formerly in the English and Scottish league system:
Brentford and Scottish sides apart they are all in a lower league position than us, granted.
Exeter City F.C.
Wycombe Wanderers F.C.
Chester F.C.
Darlington F.C.
Hereford F.C.
AFC Wimbledon
Accrington Stanley F.C.
Cambridge City F.C.
Carlisle United F.C.
Grimsby Town F.C.
York City F.C.
Brentford F.C.
Bury F.C
Chesterfield F.C.
Portsmouth F.C.
Scarborough Town F.C.
Stockport County F.C. Clyde F.C.
Dundee United F.C.
Dunfermline Athletic F.C.
East Stirlingshire F.C.
Gretna F.C.
Heart of Midlothian F.C.
Hibernian F.C.
Motherwell F.C.
Rangers F.C.
Stirling Albion F.C.
St Mirren FC [Post edited 2 Feb 2020 13:30]
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Do you honestly think we're the level of any of those teams Baz. ? Without wanting to sound like a delusional fan but i grew up with QPR being one of the top teams in London and England. Playing and beating the likes of Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool.(and losing of course)
Sorry but we should be miles ahead of those teams you mentioned. I admire the fact that you're proposing a new direction for the club but we should do better than that!.
When we filled Wembley stadium it brought home to me how big our fanbase is and how much the club is loved.
QPR has so much potential. Its just a shame TF took over the club. Maybe he had good intentions maybe he didn't.
We've got good people at the club now after the Palladini era ripping the heart out of it and for that i would give TF credit. But we need someone with ambition and clear goals laid out for them all to work to. Some direction in the world of football. TF isn't savvy enough clearly.
I've had pelters on here from other posters when i criticised TF in the past so i know i've dug my heels in a bit here but the sooner we change owners the better. He's had ten years and for me has run out of excuses. We've gone backwards on his watch , but your proposal Baz it would set us back even more. |  |
| Occasional providers of half decent House music. |
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| Is Tone a bit distracted on 18:10 - Feb 2 with 2260 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 17:01 - Feb 2 by PunteR |
Do you honestly think we're the level of any of those teams Baz. ? Without wanting to sound like a delusional fan but i grew up with QPR being one of the top teams in London and England. Playing and beating the likes of Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool.(and losing of course)
Sorry but we should be miles ahead of those teams you mentioned. I admire the fact that you're proposing a new direction for the club but we should do better than that!.
When we filled Wembley stadium it brought home to me how big our fanbase is and how much the club is loved.
QPR has so much potential. Its just a shame TF took over the club. Maybe he had good intentions maybe he didn't.
We've got good people at the club now after the Palladini era ripping the heart out of it and for that i would give TF credit. But we need someone with ambition and clear goals laid out for them all to work to. Some direction in the world of football. TF isn't savvy enough clearly.
I've had pelters on here from other posters when i criticised TF in the past so i know i've dug my heels in a bit here but the sooner we change owners the better. He's had ten years and for me has run out of excuses. We've gone backwards on his watch , but your proposal Baz it would set us back even more. |
I think we are behind Brentford, and Rangers and Motherwell are 2nd and 3rd and both looking likely for European football next year. That list I has all sorts of different types of ownership models in it, but they all have supporters at the heart of the financial and governance decisions.
We don’t need out and out ownership of our club (for now), but a controlling stake in deciding who we bring in to invest is a sensible and fair way for us to operate as it is in Spain for clubs of our size.
We can wish all day for a well meaning benefactor to come and sweep us off our feet but they are as rare as rocking horse shit and always come with complications such as the one in the original post.
I’ll leave it there. [Post edited 2 Feb 2020 18:11]
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| Is Tone a bit distracted on 18:17 - Feb 2 with 2244 views | QPR_John |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 18:10 - Feb 2 by BazzaInTheLoft |
I think we are behind Brentford, and Rangers and Motherwell are 2nd and 3rd and both looking likely for European football next year. That list I has all sorts of different types of ownership models in it, but they all have supporters at the heart of the financial and governance decisions.
We don’t need out and out ownership of our club (for now), but a controlling stake in deciding who we bring in to invest is a sensible and fair way for us to operate as it is in Spain for clubs of our size.
We can wish all day for a well meaning benefactor to come and sweep us off our feet but they are as rare as rocking horse shit and always come with complications such as the one in the original post.
I’ll leave it there. [Post edited 2 Feb 2020 18:11]
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Out of interest how much would you invest given the chance | | | |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 20:45 - Feb 2 with 2094 views | Hunterhoop |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 18:17 - Feb 2 by QPR_John |
Out of interest how much would you invest given the chance |
And what would happen when, having invested X amount, you were outvoted by other investors and a decision was made you disagreed with? |  | | |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 22:45 - Feb 2 with 2004 views | daveB |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 16:45 - Feb 2 by QPR_John |
These figures are well out of date. We have removed at least £50K
per week off the wage bill this January. [Post edited 2 Feb 2020 16:57]
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Thats from the 2017/18 season, Holloways last one as manager |  | | |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 22:55 - Feb 2 with 1992 views | WrightUp5hit___ |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 18:17 - Feb 2 by QPR_John |
Out of interest how much would you invest given the chance |
Hugely crude but
£11,000,000 per annum losses (say) and..... ooooh 10,000 fans stumping up
That would be £1,100 a head before a single penny of investment |  | | |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 04:00 - Feb 3 with 1878 views | Benny_the_Ball |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 16:04 - Feb 2 by BazzaInTheLoft |
Fair enough.
If you are happy to accept zero influence over how the club is run and let psychopaths and profit minded individuals make decisions without consequence about something I presume you hold dear then maybe letting supporters have stake in QPR isn't for you. |
Your key reason for a community club appears to be the notion that wealthy owners are capitalist psychopaths. Being the mad Commie you are, you'll know that Stalin was a psychopath, arguably the biggest of all. | | | |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 07:19 - Feb 3 with 1828 views | distortR |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 04:00 - Feb 3 by Benny_the_Ball |
Your key reason for a community club appears to be the notion that wealthy owners are capitalist psychopaths. Being the mad Commie you are, you'll know that Stalin was a psychopath, arguably the biggest of all. |
The 7 traits of a sociopath,psychopath
* pathological lying and manipulation
*lack of morality and rule breaking
*lack of empathy and cold heartedness
*Narcissism and fake superiority complex
*gaslighting and psychological bullying
*lack of contrition and self-serving victimhood
* the situational sociopath
Nope, doesn't sound like any business or political leader I've ever heard of! | | | |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 09:04 - Feb 3 with 1760 views | ShotKneesHoop |
| Is Tone a bit distracted on 15:37 - Feb 2 by PlanetHonneywood |
I appreciate that quoting Shakespeare can cause you trouble these days, but ‘Hoisted on his own petard’ isn’t one of them!! |
Oh yes it is ... it's in Hamlet. Not the Dulwich Hamlet programme though.
The same book also had "Something is rotten in the state of Denmark - and the New Den stinks as well"
But it didn't have - "E's a top, top, triffick player, and 'es worth 10 million jam roly polys" [Post edited 3 Feb 2020 9:06]
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| Why does it feel like R'SWiPe is still on the books? Yer Couldn't Make It Up.Well Done Me! |
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