| Reform Policies 18:44 - Jul 13 with 4004 views | johnlangy |
They haven't come out with many actual policies but the one that's easiest to remember is raising the tax threshold to £20,000. It's a laudable thing to aspire to as it would benefit the lowest paid the most. As well as that idea, the way Farage and Tice and all the rest of them are talking it's as if they're saying ‘vote us in and there’ll be a revolution’. The British people will finally get what they’ve been demanding for so long and which Labour and the Conservatives never delivered.
It's such an easy thing to say and I believe they're saying it knowing that there'd be a huge number of people whose knee jerk reaction would be positive. They'd be about £1500 a year better off and many wouldn't think past that.
We can all agree there's not much money around and the UK is in an incredibly difficult financial situation. And whatever party is in Government they would have a hell of a job on their hands.
So, let's imagine Reform are in power now and not Labour. And this tax cut is their flagship policy. We know that Labour have claimed that a major problem they've had to deal with is the £20 billion black hole they claim the Conservatives left (accurate or not that's what they say).
The black hole created in the countries tax revenue of raising the threshold to £20,000 is £51 billion a year. But, to give them the benefit of the doubt let’s imagine that Reform would say we can't afford to do it in one go. People would probably accept the logic of that - initially.
So they may say we'll do it in three chunks - from £12,500 to £15,000 then £17,500 and then £20,000. The first rise would put an extra £500 in people's pockets. That’s £10 a week. And let’s say they had to wait for another year for another £10 and another year for the last £10. People would say, hang on Nige, this isn't a revolution. You gave us the impression that you could just push a few buttons and our lives would change.
And then they'd say, in the parallel universe where Labour are in power, we got a 6.7% rise (National Living Wage). So how is this better Nige ?
So they've implemented the first rise but now they've got a £17 billion black hole in the finances. And this is a REAL black hole. So what are they going to do.
Which brings me to the second part of the thread. Nigel and Richard and all of them are also incredibly critical of the spend on welfare. And without saying what they are going to do they've implied that they will be ruthless in that area.
We all know what happened to Labour with the WFA cut and the proposed reform of PIP. There may be some people on this site who thought those cuts were a good idea but from memory the vast majority of you didn't. And the vast majority of the country disagreed as well.
I heard a discussion on Talk Radio a few days ago between Jeremy Kyle and Richard Tice (a brief digression - Jeremy Kyle has to be the most useless excuse for a broadcaster in the history of British radio. It's as if a ten year old is speaking through a man's body - just awful).
Anyway, the bloke who had called in, a Reform voter, was talking about the above cuts and he was criticising Labour for having given in to the 'BLOB' in dropping the plans. And Richard Tice was laughing and agreeing with him, happy it seemed that the guy was on his side. He agreed that Labour should not have given in to the ‘BLOB’, that they should have stuck to their guns. By saying that he was implying that Reform, if they were in power, would have carried on with the cuts.
The savings from those cuts would have come to maybe £5 billion I believe. So can anyone explain where they would save the extra £17 billion from their tax cuts in the first year. And in the second year the £34 billion ? And in the third year the £51 billion ?
Would it all be from the benefits bill ? The total benefits bill this year is £303 billion. Of that £138 billion is the State Pension and an enormous part of the rest is paid out to people actually in work. If you add the two together that would leave maybe £100 billion in other benefits. Are Reform going to cut that £100 billion by £51 billion ?
Going back to the phone in, the 'BLOB' is a word that's been used mainly against the Civil Service (not just the CS but mainly) saying that they actively work against the Government implementing their policies.
But in this case the people disagreeing with the Government were millions of ordinary people disgusted at the policies. Also their MP's and just about all the media. And here we have Richard Tice laughing at the 'BLOB' which in this case would include millions of the people who he would hope would vote Reform.
But I doubt if those millions would have been listening to that phone in and hearing the disdain that Tice had for them. A pity because if they did there’d be no way Reform would ever get in to power.
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| Reform Policies on 19:33 - Jul 15 with 1197 views | Whiterockin |
| Reform Policies on 18:54 - Jul 15 by SullutaCreturned |
Well that's not the important part but why not, even 400 years ago businesses had to make a profit to survive.
The point is, stock markets today are there to make masses of profit for the major shareholders.
Pension funds are managed by people who take massive chunks of money out of the profits.
It's another way to rip off the lowest paid. |
I invest in a fund and reap the rewards. Every 2 years I fill in a questionnaire regarding the risk level I want as well as the type of companies I want to invest and what markets plus other options. The last two years I received 9.2% growth per year before tax. Do you believe I am ripping off the lowest paid considering there are 100s of thousands like me. [Post edited 15 Jul 19:35]
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| Reform Policies on 20:14 - Jul 15 with 1138 views | max936 |
| Reform Policies on 19:16 - Jul 13 by SullutaCreturned |
Benefits reforms need to happen, first of all the minimum wage needs to rise to get people off universal credit. That would need to be a staged rise, small companies/businesses being made to give a smaller raise but the biggest companies being told to pay more, their profits can take it and they hide the money anway to avoid tax. A minimum wage by size of business, is that do-able?
Even then there is still a large black hole, what Reform promises is just way above what they could deliver without making a bigger mess of the country's finances than the last 50 years has done.
I've seen Max's reaction to the idea of raising taxes but if Reform came in they'd have to raise taxes to help fund this and it would still take years. what are the odds of Reform taking over government with a majority? Not very good I'd say and without that majority, would they ever get the changes through? |
The Countries finances are in a shocking state now and have been for probably longer than 10yrs, if Reform get in that'll tip us right over the edge.
Farage got all the answers, but has no idea on how he'll pay for it all, proper shyster is Farage, Farage is all about Farage and he'll never be any different.
I will add that I've no idea as to who could sort the Country out, there's no one or no party standing out that'll give me any hope, as I've said many times that the Political landscape needs a complete overall, no idea on how that's achieved though. [Post edited 15 Jul 20:17]
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| Reform Policies on 20:18 - Jul 15 with 1133 views | max936 |
| Reform Policies on 22:09 - Jul 13 by builthjack |
Aye, if everyone gets 20k tax free, as Farage says will happen, there will be no NHS, no road maintenance, no new social housing, minimal public services.
The guy talks a good game. It’s loons who listen. |
Spot on Builthy. | |
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| Reform Policies on 19:26 - Jul 16 with 1030 views | SullutaCreturned |
| Reform Policies on 20:14 - Jul 15 by max936 |
The Countries finances are in a shocking state now and have been for probably longer than 10yrs, if Reform get in that'll tip us right over the edge.
Farage got all the answers, but has no idea on how he'll pay for it all, proper shyster is Farage, Farage is all about Farage and he'll never be any different.
I will add that I've no idea as to who could sort the Country out, there's no one or no party standing out that'll give me any hope, as I've said many times that the Political landscape needs a complete overall, no idea on how that's achieved though. [Post edited 15 Jul 20:17]
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I've said it before, the people we need to make those changes will never make them, largely because it might end their gravy train too. | | | |
| Reform Policies on 11:22 - Jul 22 with 926 views | controversial_jack |
| Reform Policies on 19:26 - Jul 16 by SullutaCreturned |
I've said it before, the people we need to make those changes will never make them, largely because it might end their gravy train too. |
Farage has all the ideas. He just states the obvious, but has no idea how to accomplish them | | | |
| Reform Policies on 13:28 - Jul 22 with 877 views | builthjack |
| Reform Policies on 11:22 - Jul 22 by controversial_jack |
Farage has all the ideas. He just states the obvious, but has no idea how to accomplish them |
His maths dont add up. In fact hes already about 5 times over budget. |  |
| Swansea Indepenent Poster Of The Year 2021. Dr P / Mart66 / Roathie / Parlay / E20/ Duffle was 2nd, but he is deluded and thinks in his little twisted brain that he won. Poor sod. We let him win this year, as he has cried for a whole year. His 14 usernames, bless his cotton socks.
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| Reform Policies on 14:00 - Jul 22 with 857 views | Flashberryjack |
| Reform Policies on 13:28 - Jul 22 by builthjack |
His maths dont add up. In fact hes already about 5 times over budget. |
Which policy is over budget ? |  |
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| Reform Policies on 14:13 - Jul 22 with 849 views | Scotia |
| Reform Policies on 14:00 - Jul 22 by Flashberryjack |
Which policy is over budget ? |
All of them. | | | |
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| Reform Policies on 16:18 - Jul 22 with 808 views | SullutaCreturned |
| Reform Policies on 19:33 - Jul 15 by Whiterockin |
I invest in a fund and reap the rewards. Every 2 years I fill in a questionnaire regarding the risk level I want as well as the type of companies I want to invest and what markets plus other options. The last two years I received 9.2% growth per year before tax. Do you believe I am ripping off the lowest paid considering there are 100s of thousands like me. [Post edited 15 Jul 19:35]
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You and other small shareholders are the fop to the masses. It's those who hold the lions share who make the most money.
I've read of pay awards that insclude as bonuses more shares, those shres can be worth millions and water down a small shareholders stake too.
You make a tiny amount of money compared to the board members who hold the majority of shares.
A pensiin fund will hold a lot of shares but then the fund is plundered by the people who take fees for running the fund.
At every turn the game is stacked in favour of the rich and powerful. | | | |
| Reform Policies on 19:30 - Jul 22 with 753 views | Luther27 |
| Reform Policies on 14:13 - Jul 22 by Scotia |
All of them. |
Like Labour then. | | | |
| Reform Policies on 19:45 - Jul 22 with 733 views | raynor94 |
| Reform Policies on 19:30 - Jul 22 by Luther27 |
Like Labour then. |
Amazing how so many can forget or just ignore the last 25 years |  |
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| Reform Policies on 19:56 - Jul 22 with 704 views | union_jack |
| Reform Policies on 19:45 - Jul 22 by raynor94 |
Amazing how so many can forget or just ignore the last 25 years |
Also amazing how those going from Labour to Plaid don’t realise they are giving their countenance to Independence. PC may say they’re not ready at the moment but more people voting for them may give them the confidence to call a referendum. They’re not to be trusted. |  |
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| Reform Policies on 19:59 - Jul 22 with 701 views | Gwyn737 |
| Reform Policies on 19:56 - Jul 22 by union_jack |
Also amazing how those going from Labour to Plaid don’t realise they are giving their countenance to Independence. PC may say they’re not ready at the moment but more people voting for them may give them the confidence to call a referendum. They’re not to be trusted. |
But you can vote for Plaid and if needed, vote against independence. | | | |
| Reform Policies on 20:01 - Jul 22 with 698 views | Boundy |
| Reform Policies on 14:13 - Jul 22 by Scotia |
All of them. |
Do us a favour and break down a few for us who don't have financial nous | |
| "In a free society, the State is the servant of the people—not the master." |
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| Reform Policies on 09:00 - Jul 23 with 611 views | Boundy |
| Reform Policies on 20:01 - Jul 22 by Boundy |
Do us a favour and break down a few for us who don't have financial nous |
One will do . | |
| "In a free society, the State is the servant of the people—not the master." |
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| Reform Policies on 09:15 - Jul 23 with 602 views | Scotia |
| Reform Policies on 09:00 - Jul 23 by Boundy |
One will do . |
This does a pretty good job and that shows a £33 billion black hole before Farage has continued to make stupid promises he either knows he can't keep and is lying or is thick as pigs --- since the last election manifesto. He can't keep them becasue we can't afford them.
https://taxpolicy.org.uk/2024/06/17/reform_uk_manifesto_2024/
It also can't take in to account some of the areas they couldn't calculate because of a lack of detail.
The biggest for me though is the laughable change of Bank of England reserve rules. What kind of idiot puts that in a manifesto? The last bullet point puts it well "Reform UK don’t appear to have considered any of these issues at all; the Toby Nangle article gives the impression that Reform UK were hearing them for the first time."
Of course it also doesn't allow for the economic and social catastrophe that will follow them implementing their plans. | | | |
| Reform Policies on 11:41 - Jul 23 with 554 views | trampie |
| Reform Policies on 19:33 - Jul 15 by Whiterockin |
I invest in a fund and reap the rewards. Every 2 years I fill in a questionnaire regarding the risk level I want as well as the type of companies I want to invest and what markets plus other options. The last two years I received 9.2% growth per year before tax. Do you believe I am ripping off the lowest paid considering there are 100s of thousands like me. [Post edited 15 Jul 19:35]
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I would be happy with that return but not sure how good it is, considering how much stock markets have risen in that time frame. [Post edited 23 Jul 12:59]
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| Reform Policies on 12:54 - Jul 23 with 519 views | Boundy |
| Reform Policies on 09:15 - Jul 23 by Scotia |
This does a pretty good job and that shows a £33 billion black hole before Farage has continued to make stupid promises he either knows he can't keep and is lying or is thick as pigs --- since the last election manifesto. He can't keep them becasue we can't afford them.
https://taxpolicy.org.uk/2024/06/17/reform_uk_manifesto_2024/
It also can't take in to account some of the areas they couldn't calculate because of a lack of detail.
The biggest for me though is the laughable change of Bank of England reserve rules. What kind of idiot puts that in a manifesto? The last bullet point puts it well "Reform UK don’t appear to have considered any of these issues at all; the Toby Nangle article gives the impression that Reform UK were hearing them for the first time."
Of course it also doesn't allow for the economic and social catastrophe that will follow them implementing their plans. |
How much will ditching net zero save us ,how much foreign aid to India ,China and other countries who really aren't struggling will pay for some policies. | |
| "In a free society, the State is the servant of the people—not the master." |
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| Reform Policies on 13:17 - Jul 23 with 502 views | union_jack |
| Reform Policies on 19:33 - Jul 15 by Whiterockin |
I invest in a fund and reap the rewards. Every 2 years I fill in a questionnaire regarding the risk level I want as well as the type of companies I want to invest and what markets plus other options. The last two years I received 9.2% growth per year before tax. Do you believe I am ripping off the lowest paid considering there are 100s of thousands like me. [Post edited 15 Jul 19:35]
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What risk level is that WR? Sounds an incredibly good return. | |
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| Reform Policies on 13:52 - Jul 23 with 474 views | Whiterockin |
| Reform Policies on 13:17 - Jul 23 by union_jack |
What risk level is that WR? Sounds an incredibly good return. |
7 mate. I hover around the 6-7 level and will never go higher, I'll probably start dropping back now. I'm too old to look long term and probably wouldn't be around long enough to recover if I took a hit. It's the kids future money anyway. | | | |
| Reform Policies on 14:03 - Jul 23 with 450 views | Gwyn737 |
| Reform Policies on 12:54 - Jul 23 by Boundy |
How much will ditching net zero save us ,how much foreign aid to India ,China and other countries who really aren't struggling will pay for some policies. |
Hard to put an exact figure but probably around 7/8 billion a year.
Or put another way, a small fraction of what Brexit has/is costing us.
Yet Farage is seen as the answer 🤷🏻 | | | |
| Reform Policies on 14:37 - Jul 23 with 419 views | Scotia |
| Reform Policies on 12:54 - Jul 23 by Boundy |
How much will ditching net zero save us ,how much foreign aid to India ,China and other countries who really aren't struggling will pay for some policies. |
Well a lotmof the foreign aid budget is spent in the UK on asylum seekers, so Reform have double counted that.
The thing with Net Zero is that there is an initial cost but significant future savings and energy security advantages. Ultimately it's just an infrastructre cost. Reform claim it's £30 billion a year, that's nonsense. | | | |
| Reform Policies on 16:42 - Jul 23 with 376 views | Boundy |
| Reform Policies on 14:03 - Jul 23 by Gwyn737 |
Hard to put an exact figure but probably around 7/8 billion a year.
Or put another way, a small fraction of what Brexit has/is costing us.
Yet Farage is seen as the answer 🤷🏻 |
Brexit is gone ,finito, kaput so will be the UK economy if this madness is played out . | |
| "In a free society, the State is the servant of the people—not the master." |
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| Reform Policies on 17:20 - Jul 23 with 345 views | Gwyn737 |
| Reform Policies on 16:42 - Jul 23 by Boundy |
Brexit is gone ,finito, kaput so will be the UK economy if this madness is played out . |
I said exactly that on here a number of times and that any attempt to return should be at least a generation away.
I’ve changed my mind.
I find it mad that when we’re struggling so much we’re not looking at single market access which would be a massive boost. | | | |
| Reform Policies on 18:22 - Jul 23 with 291 views | johnlangy |
| Reform Policies on 17:20 - Jul 23 by Gwyn737 |
I said exactly that on here a number of times and that any attempt to return should be at least a generation away.
I’ve changed my mind.
I find it mad that when we’re struggling so much we’re not looking at single market access which would be a massive boost. |
Well said Gwyn.
If, for example, Labour were to stand at the next election promising a rejoin referendum the vote would not happen till maybe 2033/34 due to the complexity.
So that would be almost twenty years since the last one. No one would be able to argue that that is not enough time to make a judgement on how successful (or not) it's been | | | |
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