| Election of new Trust main board director 20:31 - May 20 with 14763 views | judd |
Having been forwarded the Trust email, just wondering if any other members have not received it directly?
I'm quite taken aback at some of the claims within it and also the foregone conclusion element too.
Personally think a Trust EGM needs to be called in order for members to direct the Trust board.
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 00:50 - May 28 with 1909 views | DorsetDale |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 00:10 - May 28 by Sandyman |
Should anyone not have received the Trust e mail of late yesterday evening....
"Trust Club Board Director Appointment. Vote Result
The survey for Trust members to decide whether or not to continue to be represented on the Club Board as the Trust appointed Club Board Director was emailed direct to members and also posted on the Trust website.
The result was as follows:
For 163 (90.56%) - Against 17 (9.44%).
Total votes cast: 180.
The number of emails sent was 694, of which 453 were opened." |
I received and opened my email. I even went to the voting page but, based on this thread could not make a committed choice either way so abstained. Those figures suggest others may have felt the same way. |  |
| YOU do not have the right to give someone else permission to tell me what I can and can't do. |
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 00:52 - May 28 with 1907 views | D_Alien |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 00:10 - May 28 by Sandyman |
Should anyone not have received the Trust e mail of late yesterday evening....
"Trust Club Board Director Appointment. Vote Result
The survey for Trust members to decide whether or not to continue to be represented on the Club Board as the Trust appointed Club Board Director was emailed direct to members and also posted on the Trust website.
The result was as follows:
For 163 (90.56%) - Against 17 (9.44%).
Total votes cast: 180.
The number of emails sent was 694, of which 453 were opened." |
Yep...
...EGM, anyone? |  |
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 06:03 - May 28 with 1778 views | TalkingSutty |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 00:50 - May 28 by DorsetDale |
I received and opened my email. I even went to the voting page but, based on this thread could not make a committed choice either way so abstained. Those figures suggest others may have felt the same way. |
I didn't get a email. It sounds like the majority have opened the email and were undecided, needed more information/ clarity. Less that half of those who opened the email decided to vote, which seems very odd. As I said, my focus is now on the CAB and supporting their ideas going forward.I think thats a great concept and the way forward when it comes to inclusivity and engagement from a fans perspective. The fact Jamie Willoughby is involved is also a big plus, he brings people together and communicates. I'm not falling out with people on the Trust and might still attend the odd fund raiser. It's not for me anymore and as a fan i don't feel represented or valued. [Post edited 28 May 7:16]
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 06:31 - May 28 with 1738 views | D_Alien |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 06:03 - May 28 by TalkingSutty |
I didn't get a email. It sounds like the majority have opened the email and were undecided, needed more information/ clarity. Less that half of those who opened the email decided to vote, which seems very odd. As I said, my focus is now on the CAB and supporting their ideas going forward.I think thats a great concept and the way forward when it comes to inclusivity and engagement from a fans perspective. The fact Jamie Willoughby is involved is also a big plus, he brings people together and communicates. I'm not falling out with people on the Trust and might still attend the odd fund raiser. It's not for me anymore and as a fan i don't feel represented or valued. [Post edited 28 May 7:16]
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Respect your choice, and you're right about CAB, but i don't think that members of the Trust requiring that the Trust board consult its members in a more nuanced way than "take it or leave it" should be seen as "falling out" [Post edited 28 May 6:33]
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 06:38 - May 28 with 1717 views | TalkingSutty |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 06:31 - May 28 by D_Alien |
Respect your choice, and you're right about CAB, but i don't think that members of the Trust requiring that the Trust board consult its members in a more nuanced way than "take it or leave it" should be seen as "falling out" [Post edited 28 May 6:33]
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No, that's not what I'm suggesting with my post. The Trust members should be absolutely consulted, especially on this particular topic. Its too late now though by the looks of it. As i pointed out, i don't feel as though they represent or value me as a member of the Trust and this vote is a typical example. There are other examples also. The world isn't always full of fluffy white clouds, sometimes difficult questions need asking and people of influence need holding to account, even if that means upsetting individuals. I feel as though not upsetting individuals or rocking the boat has been prioritised over what the core function of the Trust actually is, representing its members. Ask a difficult question and its put in the 'too hard to do' tray, for fear of upsetting somebody in the boardroom. Its damaged the Trust and confidence has been lost. The Trust Director role in my opinion not only compromises the individual fulfilling that role but also the Trust itself. Just my opinion, the Trust members are down the pecking order because of the arrangement. Others obviously feel differently if you take any notice of the vote. What I'm seeing more of now is persons of influence mingling with the fans in the bars before the games, thats great because you can actually approach people like Andy Duff and the Directors, even Cameron Ogden and personally ask them a question or discuss something face to face. That's how it should be, no need to submit questions for vetting etc, its a ridiculous concept that. We all want the same thing for the club and face to face dialogue with members of staff and those in the Boardroom should be encouraged. This is why i think the CAB is a great idea, its more inclusive and direct dialogue from fans will be welcomed. [Post edited 28 May 8:19]
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 08:53 - May 28 with 1537 views | 442Dale |
If the Trust believe that moving forward on the back of a vote where it was made clear some members had not received communication about it and where others were calling for more information in the form of a meeting, then they are risking losing support of those members in the longer term.
It could impact membership numbers too. Is that really a route they want to take? |  |
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 08:58 - May 28 with 1512 views | 442Dale |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 00:52 - May 28 by D_Alien |
Yep...
...EGM, anyone? |
I’m happy to add my name to a list if you’re collating one. | |
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 09:46 - May 28 with 1442 views | wozzrafc |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 06:38 - May 28 by TalkingSutty |
No, that's not what I'm suggesting with my post. The Trust members should be absolutely consulted, especially on this particular topic. Its too late now though by the looks of it. As i pointed out, i don't feel as though they represent or value me as a member of the Trust and this vote is a typical example. There are other examples also. The world isn't always full of fluffy white clouds, sometimes difficult questions need asking and people of influence need holding to account, even if that means upsetting individuals. I feel as though not upsetting individuals or rocking the boat has been prioritised over what the core function of the Trust actually is, representing its members. Ask a difficult question and its put in the 'too hard to do' tray, for fear of upsetting somebody in the boardroom. Its damaged the Trust and confidence has been lost. The Trust Director role in my opinion not only compromises the individual fulfilling that role but also the Trust itself. Just my opinion, the Trust members are down the pecking order because of the arrangement. Others obviously feel differently if you take any notice of the vote. What I'm seeing more of now is persons of influence mingling with the fans in the bars before the games, thats great because you can actually approach people like Andy Duff and the Directors, even Cameron Ogden and personally ask them a question or discuss something face to face. That's how it should be, no need to submit questions for vetting etc, its a ridiculous concept that. We all want the same thing for the club and face to face dialogue with members of staff and those in the Boardroom should be encouraged. This is why i think the CAB is a great idea, its more inclusive and direct dialogue from fans will be welcomed. [Post edited 28 May 8:19]
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Talking Sutty your views on this, perfectly reasonable should be ringing alarm bells within the trust. If members feel they are not being represented or not kept informed and instead feel the need to not bother rejoining then it can only hurt the trust long term. The past has taught us we need an independent body, and while it will never be perfect, it should be there as a means to immobilise fans when required.
The CAB will be a working group of multi stakeholders representing from the community groups, different demographics within the fan base and including the trust. It’s a shadow board embodying fam representation.
It’s allowing the board to set out its objectives and proposals for them to be scrutinised and advised by as wide spectrum of the fanbase. It will hopefully give an opportunity to fans who don’t feel the trust is not for them to be heard.
It won’t replace the trust, who will continue with the good work they do and enjoy a healthy relationship with the board. Indeed the trust will play an active part in the CAB. [Post edited 28 May 9:55]
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 09:57 - May 28 with 1421 views | 442Dale |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 09:46 - May 28 by wozzrafc |
Talking Sutty your views on this, perfectly reasonable should be ringing alarm bells within the trust. If members feel they are not being represented or not kept informed and instead feel the need to not bother rejoining then it can only hurt the trust long term. The past has taught us we need an independent body, and while it will never be perfect, it should be there as a means to immobilise fans when required.
The CAB will be a working group of multi stakeholders representing from the community groups, different demographics within the fan base and including the trust. It’s a shadow board embodying fam representation.
It’s allowing the board to set out its objectives and proposals for them to be scrutinised and advised by as wide spectrum of the fanbase. It will hopefully give an opportunity to fans who don’t feel the trust is not for them to be heard.
It won’t replace the trust, who will continue with the good work they do and enjoy a healthy relationship with the board. Indeed the trust will play an active part in the CAB. [Post edited 28 May 9:55]
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Those alarm bells should be ringing, but what are they going to do about it?
Your last paragraph will become irrelevant if supporters don’t have faith or want a relationship with the Trust. | |
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 10:13 - May 28 with 1380 views | wozzrafc |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 09:57 - May 28 by 442Dale |
Those alarm bells should be ringing, but what are they going to do about it?
Your last paragraph will become irrelevant if supporters don’t have faith or want a relationship with the Trust. |
That’s 💯 correct. Trusts grow stronger by their members feeling they are being represented. This is a two way street with member engagement vital.
I do feel the trust on the whole do a good job, and when it’s not fighting Morton house or trying to help stop liquidation it’s a harder sell.
But if members aren’t getting updates that being sent out or feel there isn’t the point to engage then it becomes more of an upward battle. | | | |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 10:25 - May 28 with 1346 views | D_Alien |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 06:38 - May 28 by TalkingSutty |
No, that's not what I'm suggesting with my post. The Trust members should be absolutely consulted, especially on this particular topic. Its too late now though by the looks of it. As i pointed out, i don't feel as though they represent or value me as a member of the Trust and this vote is a typical example. There are other examples also. The world isn't always full of fluffy white clouds, sometimes difficult questions need asking and people of influence need holding to account, even if that means upsetting individuals. I feel as though not upsetting individuals or rocking the boat has been prioritised over what the core function of the Trust actually is, representing its members. Ask a difficult question and its put in the 'too hard to do' tray, for fear of upsetting somebody in the boardroom. Its damaged the Trust and confidence has been lost. The Trust Director role in my opinion not only compromises the individual fulfilling that role but also the Trust itself. Just my opinion, the Trust members are down the pecking order because of the arrangement. Others obviously feel differently if you take any notice of the vote. What I'm seeing more of now is persons of influence mingling with the fans in the bars before the games, thats great because you can actually approach people like Andy Duff and the Directors, even Cameron Ogden and personally ask them a question or discuss something face to face. That's how it should be, no need to submit questions for vetting etc, its a ridiculous concept that. We all want the same thing for the club and face to face dialogue with members of staff and those in the Boardroom should be encouraged. This is why i think the CAB is a great idea, its more inclusive and direct dialogue from fans will be welcomed. [Post edited 28 May 8:19]
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Yeah, that's precisely what i meant
But you've just confirmed what i meant too - that questioning the Trust shouldn't be seen as falling out, but that's how people are made to feel and it's not right! | |
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 10:27 - May 28 with 1341 views | D_Alien |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 08:58 - May 28 by 442Dale |
I’m happy to add my name to a list if you’re collating one. |
I've said the same to wozzrafc, who seems to have a handle on how these things work [Post edited 28 May 10:28]
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 10:32 - May 28 with 1318 views | 442Dale |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 10:27 - May 28 by D_Alien |
I've said the same to wozzrafc, who seems to have a handle on how these things work [Post edited 28 May 10:28]
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Could be wrong, but from memory when this was questioned in the past, it requires 5% of the membership (adult members?) to call an EGM. If people wish to be added to that list could they PM you with their names? | |
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 10:59 - May 28 with 1293 views | D_Alien |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 10:32 - May 28 by 442Dale |
Could be wrong, but from memory when this was questioned in the past, it requires 5% of the membership (adult members?) to call an EGM. If people wish to be added to that list could they PM you with their names? |
Happy to collate names, but the actual procedure of what to do with that list is probably better being done by someone with greater familiarity with how it works
Edit: if people PM me, i'll post how many names have been collated but not who they are
Just to mention also, i'm off to Spain next Tuesday, with no guarantee of wifi so might need to happen before then [Post edited 28 May 11:01]
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 11:54 - May 28 with 1192 views | wozzrafc |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 10:25 - May 28 by D_Alien |
Yeah, that's precisely what i meant
But you've just confirmed what i meant too - that questioning the Trust shouldn't be seen as falling out, but that's how people are made to feel and it's not right! |
💯 engagement is a healthy thing. If members feel something needs to be discussed aporoaching the trust should be the first course of action.
However if this is not reciprocated then disillusionment and people both bothering will happen, or even worse they vent their frustration negatively. | | | |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 12:04 - May 28 with 1168 views | wozzrafc |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 10:32 - May 28 by 442Dale |
Could be wrong, but from memory when this was questioned in the past, it requires 5% of the membership (adult members?) to call an EGM. If people wish to be added to that list could they PM you with their names? |
The supporters trusts latest rules are available to all members here:
https://mutuals.fca.org.uk/Search/Society/3185
The latest articles set out in rule 332that a special general meeting can be requested by 5% of members or 20 whichever is greater.
It should be submitted in writing to the trust board with a clear statement of what needs to be discussed.
Rule 33 sets out the trust must hold a meeting within 28 days.
Not sure how many adult members there are , but 694 emails were sent out so 35 members would be needed.
Calling a meeting should not be seen as negative thing, it is a desire for members to discuss a particular issue. However it also needs commitment from the members to engage.
[Post edited 28 May 12:10]
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 12:19 - May 28 with 1133 views | TalkingSutty |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 12:04 - May 28 by wozzrafc |
The supporters trusts latest rules are available to all members here:
https://mutuals.fca.org.uk/Search/Society/3185
The latest articles set out in rule 332that a special general meeting can be requested by 5% of members or 20 whichever is greater.
It should be submitted in writing to the trust board with a clear statement of what needs to be discussed.
Rule 33 sets out the trust must hold a meeting within 28 days.
Not sure how many adult members there are , but 694 emails were sent out so 35 members would be needed.
Calling a meeting should not be seen as negative thing, it is a desire for members to discuss a particular issue. However it also needs commitment from the members to engage.
[Post edited 28 May 12:10]
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There are only a few discerning voices on the forum and the ones that were contacted and bothered to vote did so overwhelmingly in favour of having a Trust Director. What would be the purpose of calling a EGM? It appears to.me that the majority of members are not really interested what happens if they can't be bothered to vote. A few will be disillusioned with the Trust but you get natural wastage in all memberships and clubs. The ones who drift away are replaced with new members. George Brigham stepping down was the catalyst for me and really weakened the Trust. The formation of the CAB provides another vehicle for fans to support the club away from the pitch and that's a option i now prefer. [Post edited 28 May 12:25]
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 12:30 - May 28 with 1099 views | wozzrafc |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 12:19 - May 28 by TalkingSutty |
There are only a few discerning voices on the forum and the ones that were contacted and bothered to vote did so overwhelmingly in favour of having a Trust Director. What would be the purpose of calling a EGM? It appears to.me that the majority of members are not really interested what happens if they can't be bothered to vote. A few will be disillusioned with the Trust but you get natural wastage in all memberships and clubs. The ones who drift away are replaced with new members. George Brigham stepping down was the catalyst for me and really weakened the Trust. The formation of the CAB provides another vehicle for fans to support the club away from the pitch and that's a option i now prefer. [Post edited 28 May 12:25]
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I think the discussion needs to be around the remit/role of the supporters trusts latest rules representative to the board of directors in order to set out what people are voting for.
Of this can be discussed at a meeting in my opinion that be healthy. After all isn’t that the point this thread was started?
Yes the vote was in favour of a director, but that does change the fact the process of electing them needs to be looked at. If no one bothers then someone will be elected by depoll. But then we can’t moan if we don’t like the result.
Agreed George was a massive loss, as others were before. [Post edited 28 May 12:34]
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 12:35 - May 28 with 1077 views | TalkingSutty |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 12:30 - May 28 by wozzrafc |
I think the discussion needs to be around the remit/role of the supporters trusts latest rules representative to the board of directors in order to set out what people are voting for.
Of this can be discussed at a meeting in my opinion that be healthy. After all isn’t that the point this thread was started?
Yes the vote was in favour of a director, but that does change the fact the process of electing them needs to be looked at. If no one bothers then someone will be elected by depoll. But then we can’t moan if we don’t like the result.
Agreed George was a massive loss, as others were before. [Post edited 28 May 12:34]
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The vote has been done and dusted though. That in itself shows the contempt that Trust members are held in. Its been general knowledge that a discussion was needed in respect of the Trust Director. | | | |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 12:40 - May 28 with 1056 views | D_Alien |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 12:35 - May 28 by TalkingSutty |
The vote has been done and dusted though. That in itself shows the contempt that Trust members are held in. Its been general knowledge that a discussion was needed in respect of the Trust Director. |
The pre-emptive vote is far from the end of the matter
I'll provide an update on the numbers who've PM'd or posted in the EGM thread to add their name to the list supporting an EGM each evening - up until Monday evening
It's obviously only those who read this forum who're going to know about it though... [Post edited 28 May 13:12]
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 12:43 - May 28 with 1045 views | 100notout |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 12:19 - May 28 by TalkingSutty |
There are only a few discerning voices on the forum and the ones that were contacted and bothered to vote did so overwhelmingly in favour of having a Trust Director. What would be the purpose of calling a EGM? It appears to.me that the majority of members are not really interested what happens if they can't be bothered to vote. A few will be disillusioned with the Trust but you get natural wastage in all memberships and clubs. The ones who drift away are replaced with new members. George Brigham stepping down was the catalyst for me and really weakened the Trust. The formation of the CAB provides another vehicle for fans to support the club away from the pitch and that's a option i now prefer. [Post edited 28 May 12:25]
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There were 17 people who voted against the appointment of a Trust Director so I guess a few of them would welcome a meeting. There were also 273 people who opened the email but for whatever reason chose not to vote - a few no doubt abstained because they didn't have enough detail to make a binary decision - no doubt a good few of those would welcome a meeting. Getting 35 people to request an EGM shouldn't be a problem.
What is the purpose of an EGM? Well it gives everyone an opportunity to clear the air, to refocus and clarify objectives and to increase the effectiveness of the Trust. The CAB is a fantastic initiative but it does not and should never replace the Trust. We need a strong Trust to continue moving forward - one of the elephants in the room is the Golden Share which still remains outstanding and needs to be resolved.
My name can be added to the list. | |
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 13:30 - May 28 with 959 views | wozzrafc |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 12:35 - May 28 by TalkingSutty |
The vote has been done and dusted though. That in itself shows the contempt that Trust members are held in. Its been general knowledge that a discussion was needed in respect of the Trust Director. |
But members have the right to ask for debate.
The vote was only to ask if members still want a director. I want debate on the remit that the director is elected.
Members can decide they don’t like the approach to the election, do nothing and not renew. It’s their choice. But we can’t moan when the trust doesn’t listen or doesn’t continue to exist.
The trust is a democratic body and needs input. The mechanism is there to encourage debate. Surely it’s better as a member to let you views be known and listen to the views of others , rather than to turn away and watch from the sidelines.
This thread has shown some healthy views. I think it would be a good thing to hear others. [Post edited 28 May 14:30]
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 14:32 - May 28 with 883 views | 442Dale |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 13:30 - May 28 by wozzrafc |
But members have the right to ask for debate.
The vote was only to ask if members still want a director. I want debate on the remit that the director is elected.
Members can decide they don’t like the approach to the election, do nothing and not renew. It’s their choice. But we can’t moan when the trust doesn’t listen or doesn’t continue to exist.
The trust is a democratic body and needs input. The mechanism is there to encourage debate. Surely it’s better as a member to let you views be known and listen to the views of others , rather than to turn away and watch from the sidelines.
This thread has shown some healthy views. I think it would be a good thing to hear others. [Post edited 28 May 14:30]
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It would be a real shame if there was an insistence by the Trust that the EGM rules need to be met before a meeting is called.
They could do that now(as they could have previously) by announcing a meeting anyway. If they do nothing to acknowledge that some fans would welcome the discussion until set criteria are met, it only serves to create a wider divide between the organisation and the supporters they represent.
It would be to the Trust’s great credit if they could communicate this in the next day or so. | |
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 14:40 - May 28 with 859 views | D_Alien |
| Election of new Trust main board director on 14:32 - May 28 by 442Dale |
It would be a real shame if there was an insistence by the Trust that the EGM rules need to be met before a meeting is called.
They could do that now(as they could have previously) by announcing a meeting anyway. If they do nothing to acknowledge that some fans would welcome the discussion until set criteria are met, it only serves to create a wider divide between the organisation and the supporters they represent.
It would be to the Trust’s great credit if they could communicate this in the next day or so. |
That's a very important point
It would be far better to accommodate the growing debate than having an EGM brought to their doorstep
There should be no "their" - as in "us and them". We really all want what's best for the club | |
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| Election of new Trust main board director on 19:16 - May 28 with 629 views | 49thseason |
This has bèen a interesting discussion delving into the purpose of the trust and making comparisons with other trusts, but.. we are now in a very different place as a club with benevolent owners who, whilst not committing stupid money have a plan to finance the football aspect by creating sustainable income stream and similtaneously developing the Community Trust into a local powerhouse for civic improvement. They are enormously dominant owners in terms of shareholdings and the former large Trust shareholding is now vastly reduced, this is a whole new reality for supporters at large and the Supporters Trust.
I think the Trust has to now find a new raison d'etre, I could see it being a third element in the mix between the Community Trust and the Football club, perhaps with a funding and manpower remit putting money into things like helping with travel costs for promising youngsters, and having an active register of skills that might be used to develop new aspects of supporter interactions with the club, I am thinking of things like workplace evangelists, particular skillsets like IT or AI or organising events that the club only has to provide space for, perhaps a regular Sunday car boot or farmers market or running an Ebay shop.
The days of being a voice in the Boardroom is probably over with the Ogdens in charge and a far more professional team running things, but there will be loads of things that will require a small financial contribution or an extrs pair of hands. Maybe thats where the focus needs to be going forwards. |  | | |
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