| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT 10:01 - May 2 with 16697 views | johnlangy |
This possibilty increases by the day. And certainly did last night. But something was said by a Reform person this morning that if they were to become the next government could result in a monumental constitutional crisis.
Imagine at the next GE Reform were to stand on a policy of leaving the ECHR. Then they are elected and produce legislation to that effect. They get it through the House of Commons and it goes to the House of Lords. There is not one Reform peer in the HOL and the vast bulk of the 850 or so peers is made up of Labour/Conservative/Lib Dem etc etc peers who would fight tooth and nail to scupper the plan.
I wonder what the public's reaction would be at seeing the 'establishment' preventing something happening that they had voted for. It is certainly something Reform would try to do and it would be refreshing in an odd sort of way (i'm not a Reform voter) to see a party actually do what they said they would do in their manifesto.
And there's the crisis. You could argue that this would be the best argument for scrapping the HOL all together. Because in this instance many would argue that democracy is broken. Others would say the HOL is part of our democracy.
Then the question is, does democracy belong to the 70 million of us or the 850 of them. |  | | |  |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 00:43 - Jun 26 with 773 views | DJack |
Not a great start in local government...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c93knke95peo |  |
| It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan |
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| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 07:24 - Jun 26 with 716 views | Scotia |
Similar to Leicester.
They're already a diasaster at local level. Why does anyone thin they are electable? | | | |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 09:16 - Jun 26 with 670 views | Whiterockin |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 07:24 - Jun 26 by Scotia |
Similar to Leicester.
They're already a diasaster at local level. Why does anyone thin they are electable? |
Because the Conservatives are unelectable, Labour is unelectable and in Wales Plaid are heading that way. The alternative choice is? Don't say independents, because there would never be an agreement on anything. |  | | |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 09:16 - Jun 26 with 670 views | Boundy |
Read all about it :Shock ,horror some one falls ill and retires :. | |
| "In a free society, the State is the servant of the people—not the master." |
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| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 09:59 - Jun 26 with 637 views | Scotia |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 09:16 - Jun 26 by Whiterockin |
Because the Conservatives are unelectable, Labour is unelectable and in Wales Plaid are heading that way. The alternative choice is? Don't say independents, because there would never be an agreement on anything. |
Reform are the most unelectable of the lot.
Labour, particulalry in Wales, are rubbish and haven't delivered. They need to go.
The Tories ruined the country and are useless.
The Lib Dems just won't attract enough votes.
Plaid are too similar to Labour.
All are a better alternative then Reform.
Reform are just a load of hot air. They can't fund what they're pledging and can't deliver what they claim.
They also don't seem to have a capable candidate anywhere in the country. [Post edited 26 Jun 10:06]
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| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 10:00 - Jun 26 with 636 views | Scotia |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 09:16 - Jun 26 by Boundy |
Read all about it :Shock ,horror some one falls ill and retires :. |
It's not the retirement that's the problem. It's the calibre of candidates in the first place.
Do you think an 18 year old has sufficient experience to be in charge of £500 million of public money? | | | |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 10:11 - Jun 26 with 610 views | Whiterockin |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 09:59 - Jun 26 by Scotia |
Reform are the most unelectable of the lot.
Labour, particulalry in Wales, are rubbish and haven't delivered. They need to go.
The Tories ruined the country and are useless.
The Lib Dems just won't attract enough votes.
Plaid are too similar to Labour.
All are a better alternative then Reform.
Reform are just a load of hot air. They can't fund what they're pledging and can't deliver what they claim.
They also don't seem to have a capable candidate anywhere in the country. [Post edited 26 Jun 10:06]
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It seems the majority disagree with you and those are the ones driving the opinion polls. | | | |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 10:13 - Jun 26 with 604 views | johnlangy |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 09:16 - Jun 26 by Boundy |
Read all about it :Shock ,horror some one falls ill and retires :. |
It's only been seven weeks since he was elected so you have to wonder why he was okay to run for election on the 1st May but not okay to carry on now. Although, trying to be fair, it is possible for someone's health to deteriorate quickly. On the other hand he's still well enough to carry on as a councillor.
But you have to ask, what sort of a party would elect an 18 year old as the Deputy Council Leader. | | | |
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| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 10:51 - Jun 26 with 583 views | union_jack |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 10:13 - Jun 26 by johnlangy |
It's only been seven weeks since he was elected so you have to wonder why he was okay to run for election on the 1st May but not okay to carry on now. Although, trying to be fair, it is possible for someone's health to deteriorate quickly. On the other hand he's still well enough to carry on as a councillor.
But you have to ask, what sort of a party would elect an 18 year old as the Deputy Council Leader. |
I could glibly answer that if you’re good enough, you’re old enough.
BUT, I do tend to agree that it was a mistake and they hadn’t foreseen this eventuality happening. |  |
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| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 16:00 - Jun 26 with 544 views | SullutaCreturned |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 10:11 - Jun 26 by Whiterockin |
It seems the majority disagree with you and those are the ones driving the opinion polls. |
Maybe it's just the polls are incorrect or unbalanced?
We'll see when the actaul vote happens I guess. | | | |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 16:12 - Jun 26 with 537 views | Whiterockin |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 16:00 - Jun 26 by SullutaCreturned |
Maybe it's just the polls are incorrect or unbalanced?
We'll see when the actaul vote happens I guess. |
It could well be voters sending out a warning to the mainstream parties, do what we want or you are out and it seems to be having an effect. I wouldn't like to call the next Senedd or General elections. | | | |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 16:58 - Jun 26 with 505 views | Kilkennyjack |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 10:11 - Jun 26 by Whiterockin |
It seems the majority disagree with you and those are the ones driving the opinion polls. |
No chance that a majority in Wales support Reform.
Its just the Tories and other right wing populists.
Mid 30’s in Wales max.
Could be largest single party though. |  |
| Beware of the Risen People
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| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 17:00 - Jun 26 with 499 views | Kilkennyjack |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 16:12 - Jun 26 by Whiterockin |
It could well be voters sending out a warning to the mainstream parties, do what we want or you are out and it seems to be having an effect. I wouldn't like to call the next Senedd or General elections. |
The will be a progressive majority.
Reform the oppo. | |
| Beware of the Risen People
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| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 17:08 - Jun 26 with 483 views | Scotia |
That'll give us a Plaid led coalition. | | | |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 17:08 - Jun 26 with 483 views | Boundy |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 10:00 - Jun 26 by Scotia |
It's not the retirement that's the problem. It's the calibre of candidates in the first place.
Do you think an 18 year old has sufficient experience to be in charge of £500 million of public money? |
No I don't but I'm sure if if something similar should happen in another council there would be support available so lets see what, if anything develops from this , although it looks like your mind is made up already .
You'd rather any of the other parties in charge than a party whose never held a position of power anywhere in the country other than the very recent council elections so what you've based your decision on is baffling tbh. | |
| "In a free society, the State is the servant of the people—not the master." |
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| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 17:30 - Jun 26 with 466 views | Whiterockin |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 17:08 - Jun 26 by Scotia |
That'll give us a Plaid led coalition. |
Too early to tell yet. | | | |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 18:13 - Jun 26 with 405 views | majorraglan |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 16:58 - Jun 26 by Kilkennyjack |
No chance that a majority in Wales support Reform.
Its just the Tories and other right wing populists.
Mid 30’s in Wales max.
Could be largest single party though. |
I think you’d be surprised.
A lot of people have had a guts full in general and immigration is a major bone of contention for many, if not the main issue. People perceive Reform as the answer to the problem and believe they will sort it out. Whether that’s actually going to be the case IDK, but only a fool would dismiss them out of hand.
As has been shown in the past many voters don’t have a clue about what’s going on, but a slick campaign, with plenty of soundbites ( regardless of how silly they may actually be in reality) and a bottom less pit of cash think Musk, Tice etc and there’s some potential. Remember Boris, plenty of noise but not wanting to face scrutiny, hiding in the milk parlour etc.
Anyone with half a brain knows the £20k tax free allowance is impossible to fund without the decimation of public services, NHS, welfare or maybe a combination of all 3, but people believe it can happen and it is affordable. They are only hearing 1 thing and they are listenning. We saw what happened iwith Brexit, Cameron thought it would never happen and the public gave him 1 in the eye.
Never say never. [Post edited 26 Jun 23:00]
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| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 18:32 - Jun 26 with 390 views | SullutaCreturned |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 09:16 - Jun 26 by Whiterockin |
Because the Conservatives are unelectable, Labour is unelectable and in Wales Plaid are heading that way. The alternative choice is? Don't say independents, because there would never be an agreement on anything. |
You can't be certain that independents wouldn't agree on anything. One bonus would be a fgree vote for all and maybe they'd actually vote the way the majority of their constituents would like too.
Actually being from an area and having that local experience means they serve that aeea better too.
The way Welsh Labour have made it, we could end up with any old Tom, Dick or Harriet from anywhere, what will they know about local issues? | | | |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 20:21 - Jun 26 with 363 views | Boundy |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 18:32 - Jun 26 by SullutaCreturned |
You can't be certain that independents wouldn't agree on anything. One bonus would be a fgree vote for all and maybe they'd actually vote the way the majority of their constituents would like too.
Actually being from an area and having that local experience means they serve that aeea better too.
The way Welsh Labour have made it, we could end up with any old Tom, Dick or Harriet from anywhere, what will they know about local issues? |
Swansea Wests' very own Torsten Bell a prime example of someone being "parachuting in" pity about the parachute | |
| "In a free society, the State is the servant of the people—not the master." |
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| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 20:22 - Jun 26 with 363 views | Scotia |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 17:08 - Jun 26 by Boundy |
No I don't but I'm sure if if something similar should happen in another council there would be support available so lets see what, if anything develops from this , although it looks like your mind is made up already .
You'd rather any of the other parties in charge than a party whose never held a position of power anywhere in the country other than the very recent council elections so what you've based your decision on is baffling tbh. |
My opinion on reform is based on their unworkable and unaffordable policies and the calibre of their elected representatives.
The support will come from the very people Reform want rid off local council management and their staff. The other councillors will set him and Reform up to fail, they won't be able to respond and the local people will suffer. Imagine that on a national scale!
What baffles me is why anyone would vote for them there's another thread on that with no answers. | | | |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 20:25 - Jun 26 with 359 views | Scotia |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 17:30 - Jun 26 by Whiterockin |
Too early to tell yet. |
I don't think Reform will get 51% of the vote, and can't see them forming a coalition with anyone.
Plaid may come second but they'll get the Greens, Lib Dems and Labour on board with them.
Maybe that'll be enough of a kick up the arris the Senedd needs. | | | |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 21:01 - Jun 26 with 337 views | Dr_Winston |
The primary thing that will happen in the event of a Reform vote big enough to force Labour, the Lib Dems, Plaid and the Greens into a Coalition is the four parties will do their level best to rig the system so it never happens again.
They're not looking to increase the number of Senedd Members or decreased the voting age to 16 in the past because they think it'll make them less likely to be elected. And they did those things when "their side" were already strong.
Faced with a serious existential threat they will do their absolute best to end meaningful democracy at Welsh Government level. [Post edited 26 Jun 21:02]
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| Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. |
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| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 21:22 - Jun 26 with 322 views | Gwyn737 |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 18:13 - Jun 26 by majorraglan |
I think you’d be surprised.
A lot of people have had a guts full in general and immigration is a major bone of contention for many, if not the main issue. People perceive Reform as the answer to the problem and believe they will sort it out. Whether that’s actually going to be the case IDK, but only a fool would dismiss them out of hand.
As has been shown in the past many voters don’t have a clue about what’s going on, but a slick campaign, with plenty of soundbites ( regardless of how silly they may actually be in reality) and a bottom less pit of cash think Musk, Tice etc and there’s some potential. Remember Boris, plenty of noise but not wanting to face scrutiny, hiding in the milk parlour etc.
Anyone with half a brain knows the £20k tax free allowance is impossible to fund without the decimation of public services, NHS, welfare or maybe a combination of all 3, but people believe it can happen and it is affordable. They are only hearing 1 thing and they are listenning. We saw what happened iwith Brexit, Cameron thought it would never happen and the public gave him 1 in the eye.
Never say never. [Post edited 26 Jun 23:00]
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Re the third paragraph, there seems to be a recent phenomenon where mad things can be promised and when they inevitably fail, we’re told the idea was fine but it was badly implemented.
See the Truss budget and (tin hat on), Brexit.
That way people never have to say they were wrong or acknowledge terrible ideas/promises.
In regard to the OP, there’s every chance that Reform will do incredibly well in upcoming elections but when it comes to the next GE, voters won’t go for Farage who is far less popular than his party. | | | |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 21:46 - Jun 26 with 297 views | Kilkennyjack |
| REFORM IN GOVERNMENT on 17:08 - Jun 26 by Scotia |
That'll give us a Plaid led coalition. |
Exactly.
Vote Reform. Vote amateur hour.
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| Beware of the Risen People
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