| Marti, stick or twist? 18:34 - Apr 18 with 68094 views | Gloucs_R |
I'm really hoping all of the rumours about Marti leaving at the end of the season are untrue.
Consistency is absolutely key for us.
I think he's doing a decent job, definitely had his challenges this year.
What is everyone else's view?
Gary O'Neill would be my alternative if he were to depart. But I would much rather he was here next season. |  |
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| Marti, stick or twist? on 09:19 - Apr 25 with 1764 views | lassel |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 09:01 - Apr 25 by loftus77 |
West Brom (like Norwich) not a bed of roses, though, in terms of finances, trajectory and ownership IMHO. Still hoping Marti will consider this - grass rarely ever greener... [Post edited 25 Apr 9:02]
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West Brom are remarkably similar to QPR to be honest. Owned and operated by a rich kid in the mould of Ruben, with a money manager bro in the mould of Bhatia installed as DOF.
They do have an MD with 20 years in the role though and Ian Pearce, two decades as a PL centre back and former Brighton Head Scout managing the recruitment for them.
Purely my opinion but I wouldn’t be surprised if he was up for it if they offered it to him, his agent has certainly talked to clubs in worse states in the past few weeks. |  | | |
| Marti, stick or twist? (n/t) on 09:26 - Apr 25 with 1702 views | mart_Goblin |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 08:29 - Apr 25 by Markofthegrove |
This is how easy it is to pull the wool over someones eyes. |
[Post edited 25 Apr 10:17]
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| Marti, stick or twist? on 09:49 - Apr 25 with 1618 views | wombat |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 09:19 - Apr 25 by lassel |
West Brom are remarkably similar to QPR to be honest. Owned and operated by a rich kid in the mould of Ruben, with a money manager bro in the mould of Bhatia installed as DOF.
They do have an MD with 20 years in the role though and Ian Pearce, two decades as a PL centre back and former Brighton Head Scout managing the recruitment for them.
Purely my opinion but I wouldn’t be surprised if he was up for it if they offered it to him, his agent has certainly talked to clubs in worse states in the past few weeks. |
out of all the clubs looking id say west brom would be the best fit for him step up for sure on all fronts , so jimmy dunne to join him as well id guess |  |
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| Marti, stick or twist? on 09:51 - Apr 25 with 1597 views | TheChef |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 22:01 - Apr 24 by theone_theonly |
He signed Hayden Frey and Andersen in the first transfer window who were instrumental in keeping us up.
He then signed a very good replacement for Hayden on a (presumably) much lower wage in Varane. Like I said before, a lot of his signings have become key players for us this year.
Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't he originally hired to audit the club? According the the club website RETEXO have clients including Roma, Athletic Bilbao, and Real Madrid. That seems like pretty good pedigree to me. [Post edited 24 Apr 22:14]
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Just to point out Nourry was announced as CEO on 12th January 2024 - can't say for sure if these signings were definitely his, or they were already in the pipeline and he just rubber-stamped them. |  |
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| Marti, stick or twist? on 10:13 - Apr 25 with 1459 views | lassel |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 09:49 - Apr 25 by wombat |
out of all the clubs looking id say west brom would be the best fit for him step up for sure on all fronts , so jimmy dunne to join him as well id guess |
As posited yesterday, my personal suspicion is that his team gave the nod for the Sun article because someone else has decided to bin off their manager and fancy getting him in to run an eye over the squad and take a game or two before they make their summer plans. | | | |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 10:13 - Apr 25 with 1453 views | BAWHoops |
Thing is, if he was happy here and WBA came in for him he'd still leave regardless.
Bigger club with more money and better infastructure |  |
| http://blogandwhitehoops.wordpress.com/ |
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| Marti, stick or twist? on 10:15 - Apr 25 with 1438 views | TheChef |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 10:13 - Apr 25 by BAWHoops |
Thing is, if he was happy here and WBA came in for him he'd still leave regardless.
Bigger club with more money and better infastructure |
Yep.
And the bottom line is, Marti was not Nourry's choice. He's at the point where he'll want his own man (or woman!). | |
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| Marti, stick or twist? on 10:16 - Apr 25 with 1438 views | daveB |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 06:15 - Apr 25 by Wilkinswatercarrier |
Sorry, I didn't mean those out on loan were necessarily going to make it, but by moving them out it created space for those in the younger ages to play at DS level. I think we may have had a couple of 15/16yo playing, which is great.
We can't deny that is a good thing.
If I knew that Nourry was going to be here for the next 10 years I would chose him over the manager. The things being implemented by the club (including the traing ground) takes years to bear fruit and we have to start sometime. We can't keep resetting every 2 seasons.
I don't trust Nourry, but nor do I trust a manager that walks out after 18 months at every job.
Probably time to shake hands and part ways with MC if the relationship is broken. |
haven't we always done that with kids on loan and younger kids in the under 18's team, thats part of why the under 18's results are always so crap
We seemed to have 8/10 players out on loan every year when Ferdinand was running the place, it's no different now
It drives me a bit mad that we're doing exactly the same as we did under les but with different job titles and finishing in exactly the same place in the league, nothing at all has changed. It wasn't working under les and it's not now
I share Marti's frustrations with it all |  | | |
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| Marti, stick or twist? on 10:27 - Apr 25 with 1357 views | KensalT |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 09:19 - Apr 25 by lassel |
West Brom are remarkably similar to QPR to be honest. Owned and operated by a rich kid in the mould of Ruben, with a money manager bro in the mould of Bhatia installed as DOF.
They do have an MD with 20 years in the role though and Ian Pearce, two decades as a PL centre back and former Brighton Head Scout managing the recruitment for them.
Purely my opinion but I wouldn’t be surprised if he was up for it if they offered it to him, his agent has certainly talked to clubs in worse states in the past few weeks. |
"Owned and operated by a rich kid in the mould of Ruben"
Ruben is 48. Bit long in the tooth to still be calling him a "rich kid"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruben_Gnanalingam | | | |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 10:30 - Apr 25 with 1324 views | loftus77 |
Anyone know when Marti's pre-Burnley interview will be out today? Just asking for a friend. | | | |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 10:43 - Apr 25 with 1256 views | Rsole |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 10:30 - Apr 25 by loftus77 |
Anyone know when Marti's pre-Burnley interview will be out today? Just asking for a friend. |
He’s got ShepherdsBushHolm syndrome, so watch out for more blinking and nose scratching indicators. |  |
| Those possessed by devils, try and keep them under control a bit, can't you ?
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| Marti, stick or twist? on 10:44 - Apr 25 with 1253 views | JamesB1979 |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 10:16 - Apr 25 by daveB |
haven't we always done that with kids on loan and younger kids in the under 18's team, thats part of why the under 18's results are always so crap
We seemed to have 8/10 players out on loan every year when Ferdinand was running the place, it's no different now
It drives me a bit mad that we're doing exactly the same as we did under les but with different job titles and finishing in exactly the same place in the league, nothing at all has changed. It wasn't working under les and it's not now
I share Marti's frustrations with it all |
Look at the squad we started the season with under Ainsworth and the squad we are finishing with this season. We’ve got genuinely decent young players in Morrison, Varane, Morgan, Kolli, Dembele and maybe some others in Vale, Bennie and Sutton and hopefully Saito will sign on a permanent. We’ve tied down Chair, Field and JCS who are probably our best players. Granted most are out injured but I think squad is in a much better position than 2 years ago. To say we haven’t progressed since Les left is ridiculous. The squad that started 23-24 season was full of players that were either in last year of contract, or were not good enough or had eyes elsewhere or brought in last minute I in panic to keep us up (Cook). It was a miracle we stayed up due to Marti and just through pure luck that key players like JCS, Cook, Field, Chair and Dunne played every game (I think?) since January 2024. | | | |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 10:58 - Apr 25 with 1173 views | KensalT |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 06:15 - Apr 25 by Wilkinswatercarrier |
Sorry, I didn't mean those out on loan were necessarily going to make it, but by moving them out it created space for those in the younger ages to play at DS level. I think we may have had a couple of 15/16yo playing, which is great.
We can't deny that is a good thing.
If I knew that Nourry was going to be here for the next 10 years I would chose him over the manager. The things being implemented by the club (including the traing ground) takes years to bear fruit and we have to start sometime. We can't keep resetting every 2 seasons.
I don't trust Nourry, but nor do I trust a manager that walks out after 18 months at every job.
Probably time to shake hands and part ways with MC if the relationship is broken. |
"I don't trust Nourry, but nor do I trust a manager that walks out after 18 months at every job."
You make it sound like Cifuentes has a sulk and strops off every 18 months.
He hasn't walked and he hasn't been sacked with loads of compo (Mourinho stylee).
He has traded up every time and his club has received compensation.
We had to pay Hammarby compensation to get him here. At the very least we should be backing him to the extent that we can recover that initial investment.
And he's currently the fifth longest serving manager in the Championship:
https://footballrates.com/longeststaymanagers/championship
Managers at this level typically survive about as long as public schoolboy captains in the Somme trenches. | | | |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:00 - Apr 25 with 1160 views | daveB |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 10:44 - Apr 25 by JamesB1979 |
Look at the squad we started the season with under Ainsworth and the squad we are finishing with this season. We’ve got genuinely decent young players in Morrison, Varane, Morgan, Kolli, Dembele and maybe some others in Vale, Bennie and Sutton and hopefully Saito will sign on a permanent. We’ve tied down Chair, Field and JCS who are probably our best players. Granted most are out injured but I think squad is in a much better position than 2 years ago. To say we haven’t progressed since Les left is ridiculous. The squad that started 23-24 season was full of players that were either in last year of contract, or were not good enough or had eyes elsewhere or brought in last minute I in panic to keep us up (Cook). It was a miracle we stayed up due to Marti and just through pure luck that key players like JCS, Cook, Field, Chair and Dunne played every game (I think?) since January 2024. |
Depends what you mean by progression. I'd agree we have a better squad than when he left but we had decent squads under him as well at times and the end result was usually the same in finishing bottom half.
I just don't see any real difference in what we were doing under him to what we are doing now despite hearing all the time how everything has changed.
The scouting team is the same and they sign a few good ones and a few not so good ones, whenever they spend a few million on players they are usually a flop and that goes back to Conor Washington days.
We've got Kolli coming through from the academy and Sutton but this is all Chris Ramseys work, whether the kids we've paid money for come good or not time will tell, I hope they do but a real unknown
We always have some decent players but very rarely a good team because the focus at the club is not to build a good team to win games it's to develop players we can sell on so for a manager with any ambition thats always going to be a problem at some point, happened under Les and is happening again now. You are also stuck in a circle of hell because without a good team those good players are not going to reach their potential and be sold for any amount of Money. Eze only ended up going for big money because we were quite good that season.
You go back years how good a player was Buzsaky but he never progressed because the teams he played in were shit and losing most weeks, even Adel was the same until we put a good team around him
For me if Nourry or Marti left tomorrow things wouldn't particularly change too much because the owners don't really know how to achieve success in football. We'll be bottom half again next season with a higher chance of going down than up | | | |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:08 - Apr 25 with 1091 views | slmrstid |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:00 - Apr 25 by daveB |
Depends what you mean by progression. I'd agree we have a better squad than when he left but we had decent squads under him as well at times and the end result was usually the same in finishing bottom half.
I just don't see any real difference in what we were doing under him to what we are doing now despite hearing all the time how everything has changed.
The scouting team is the same and they sign a few good ones and a few not so good ones, whenever they spend a few million on players they are usually a flop and that goes back to Conor Washington days.
We've got Kolli coming through from the academy and Sutton but this is all Chris Ramseys work, whether the kids we've paid money for come good or not time will tell, I hope they do but a real unknown
We always have some decent players but very rarely a good team because the focus at the club is not to build a good team to win games it's to develop players we can sell on so for a manager with any ambition thats always going to be a problem at some point, happened under Les and is happening again now. You are also stuck in a circle of hell because without a good team those good players are not going to reach their potential and be sold for any amount of Money. Eze only ended up going for big money because we were quite good that season.
You go back years how good a player was Buzsaky but he never progressed because the teams he played in were shit and losing most weeks, even Adel was the same until we put a good team around him
For me if Nourry or Marti left tomorrow things wouldn't particularly change too much because the owners don't really know how to achieve success in football. We'll be bottom half again next season with a higher chance of going down than up |
I pretty much agree with everything you've said Dave, and I think it shows ultimately to be truly successful in football, certainly in this league/country, it simply comes down to how much money you spend on your main squad of 20, and everything else is ultimately irrelevant.
For some clubs that's been by the buy-low-sell-high model, but actually very few clubs have achieved success that way. Brentford/Brighton sure...Bristol City this year but its taken them years and they've still had near misses the other way several times.
For the vast majority - its just rich owners ploughing money in and hoping it all works out. All our models can be well and good but when you've got the likes of Leeds/Sheffield United coming down here with seven times our wage bill its just impossible to compete over a season.
If we continue this same trajectory/strategy, we'll just carry on treading water in the bottom third, circling the drain until eventually we fall through.
That said, I'm not saying I'd advocate the owners going "fk it" and whallopping millions in, breaking all spending limits and hoping for the best, we've done that already and know all too well how disastrous it can be if/when it doesn't work out.
Its all quite disheartening overall... |  | | |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:08 - Apr 25 with 1076 views | TK1 |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 10:44 - Apr 25 by JamesB1979 |
Look at the squad we started the season with under Ainsworth and the squad we are finishing with this season. We’ve got genuinely decent young players in Morrison, Varane, Morgan, Kolli, Dembele and maybe some others in Vale, Bennie and Sutton and hopefully Saito will sign on a permanent. We’ve tied down Chair, Field and JCS who are probably our best players. Granted most are out injured but I think squad is in a much better position than 2 years ago. To say we haven’t progressed since Les left is ridiculous. The squad that started 23-24 season was full of players that were either in last year of contract, or were not good enough or had eyes elsewhere or brought in last minute I in panic to keep us up (Cook). It was a miracle we stayed up due to Marti and just through pure luck that key players like JCS, Cook, Field, Chair and Dunne played every game (I think?) since January 2024. |
Come on, it was only two years ago.
Les Ferdinand left the club in June 2023. He had nothing to do with the Ainsworth squad that started two months later in 2023-24. In truth, the board knew he was leaving - as we all did - from early 2023. The disarray of Ainsworth's summer, preseason and start of 23/24 was entirely down to our current chair Lee Hoos and then chair Bhatia who made Ainsworth their man.
The last squad he helped assemble and largely signed included Dieng, Dickie, Dunne, JCS, Willock, Field, Dykes, Chair, etc etc. Basis of a good squad, one that briefly aimed for promotion. And if you're talking about signing young players with potential, well, Eze, Bright, Chair and Dieng came through under LF/CR. I hope, as we all do, that four of our current young players have the same outcomes as these.
Under LF, we had some slightly better seasons than the current one (maybe a couple substantially so under Warburton) and one worse, which was the final nail in his coffin. We had worse financial pressures throughout, though, none of which were his doing. Every season under Warburton we ended in hope for the next, just as we did last season - but maybe not this.
Dave is totally right. Some minor staffing tweaks aside, it's hard to see a material difference between the two yet. | | | |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:11 - Apr 25 with 1042 views | JamesB1979 |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:00 - Apr 25 by daveB |
Depends what you mean by progression. I'd agree we have a better squad than when he left but we had decent squads under him as well at times and the end result was usually the same in finishing bottom half.
I just don't see any real difference in what we were doing under him to what we are doing now despite hearing all the time how everything has changed.
The scouting team is the same and they sign a few good ones and a few not so good ones, whenever they spend a few million on players they are usually a flop and that goes back to Conor Washington days.
We've got Kolli coming through from the academy and Sutton but this is all Chris Ramseys work, whether the kids we've paid money for come good or not time will tell, I hope they do but a real unknown
We always have some decent players but very rarely a good team because the focus at the club is not to build a good team to win games it's to develop players we can sell on so for a manager with any ambition thats always going to be a problem at some point, happened under Les and is happening again now. You are also stuck in a circle of hell because without a good team those good players are not going to reach their potential and be sold for any amount of Money. Eze only ended up going for big money because we were quite good that season.
You go back years how good a player was Buzsaky but he never progressed because the teams he played in were shit and losing most weeks, even Adel was the same until we put a good team around him
For me if Nourry or Marti left tomorrow things wouldn't particularly change too much because the owners don't really know how to achieve success in football. We'll be bottom half again next season with a higher chance of going down than up |
But it’s about how the squad progressed under Les during the 9 years of this reign. We had to reduce wage bill but the squads got progressively worse and we allowed players to run down contracts and didn’t sell at the right time.
We have constantly said that the manager has previously got what he wanted, he leaves and we do it all again. That is unsustainable. Let’s see what happens when we do have a new manager this year or next. That will show whether what we are doing is working or if it is any different.
A manager may not like us having to buy players and then develop and sell for a profit but that’s what being a manager of a club like us is like. | | | |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:15 - Apr 25 with 1012 views | lassel |
I mean if you want to depress yourself, Paris Hilton is 45 now…I still wouldn’t consider her anything other than a rich kid still though. | | | |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:18 - Apr 25 with 982 views | JamesB1979 |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:08 - Apr 25 by TK1 |
Come on, it was only two years ago.
Les Ferdinand left the club in June 2023. He had nothing to do with the Ainsworth squad that started two months later in 2023-24. In truth, the board knew he was leaving - as we all did - from early 2023. The disarray of Ainsworth's summer, preseason and start of 23/24 was entirely down to our current chair Lee Hoos and then chair Bhatia who made Ainsworth their man.
The last squad he helped assemble and largely signed included Dieng, Dickie, Dunne, JCS, Willock, Field, Dykes, Chair, etc etc. Basis of a good squad, one that briefly aimed for promotion. And if you're talking about signing young players with potential, well, Eze, Bright, Chair and Dieng came through under LF/CR. I hope, as we all do, that four of our current young players have the same outcomes as these.
Under LF, we had some slightly better seasons than the current one (maybe a couple substantially so under Warburton) and one worse, which was the final nail in his coffin. We had worse financial pressures throughout, though, none of which were his doing. Every season under Warburton we ended in hope for the next, just as we did last season - but maybe not this.
Dave is totally right. Some minor staffing tweaks aside, it's hard to see a material difference between the two yet. |
He was here for 9 years! How can he have nothing to do with that squad. Dickie and Dieng both sold for peanuts. Willock not sold and allowed to run contract down. No new contracts for Field and Chair.
We also had numerous players in youth / first team set up that were blatantly not good enough and just allowed to stay here.
I’m not saying Les didn’t do some good stuff. Of course he did. But we are definitely in a better squad position than when he left.
Let’s not forget that he and Warbs fell out over youth players. Who ended up being right there? | | | |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:27 - Apr 25 with 908 views | JamesB1979 |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:15 - Apr 25 by lassel |
I mean if you want to depress yourself, Paris Hilton is 45 now…I still wouldn’t consider her anything other than a rich kid still though. |
Blimey you go to some lengths to justify your point. Sometimes maybe admit it wasn’t a great comparison. | | | |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:32 - Apr 25 with 874 views | daveB |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:11 - Apr 25 by JamesB1979 |
But it’s about how the squad progressed under Les during the 9 years of this reign. We had to reduce wage bill but the squads got progressively worse and we allowed players to run down contracts and didn’t sell at the right time.
We have constantly said that the manager has previously got what he wanted, he leaves and we do it all again. That is unsustainable. Let’s see what happens when we do have a new manager this year or next. That will show whether what we are doing is working or if it is any different.
A manager may not like us having to buy players and then develop and sell for a profit but that’s what being a manager of a club like us is like. |
During those 9 years we had a good squad a few times, the one under Warbs was good but then it drifted away becasue they flip flop between sell someone for profit and then oh christ we might have a good team lets throw money at it and dig an even bigger hole. They did it again last summer spending quite big on Madsen, Varane and Celar and now back in a hole again unless Eze is sold. As I say it comes down to the owners not knowing what they want or how to achieve it
I don't want it to turn into a Les is better or Nourry is better type of conversation, they both did some good and some bad, I just look at what we are doing as a club now and what were trying to do under les and It looks the same to me with the same results
even to the point that we lost a good manager in Warbs becasue of a fall out and we're about to do the same again. Whatever side you sit on the argument if you agree with Nourry or Marti, if you agreed with Les or Warbs it doesn't really matter, the fall out is we all lose [Post edited 25 Apr 11:37]
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| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:34 - Apr 25 with 861 views | hubble |
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| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:39 - Apr 25 with 823 views | lassel |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:27 - Apr 25 by JamesB1979 |
Blimey you go to some lengths to justify your point. Sometimes maybe admit it wasn’t a great comparison. |
Well Ruben’s career was go to work for dads business and take over dads business when he died, so pretty stereotypical rich kid. But absolutely we can relabel Ruben as ‘rich kid who got older and is now middle aged’ rather than just ‘rich kid’. | | | |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:44 - Apr 25 with 786 views | JamesB1979 |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:39 - Apr 25 by lassel |
Well Ruben’s career was go to work for dads business and take over dads business when he died, so pretty stereotypical rich kid. But absolutely we can relabel Ruben as ‘rich kid who got older and is now middle aged’ rather than just ‘rich kid’. |
🤦♂️ | | | |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:47 - Apr 25 with 774 views | JamesB1979 |
| Marti, stick or twist? on 11:32 - Apr 25 by daveB |
During those 9 years we had a good squad a few times, the one under Warbs was good but then it drifted away becasue they flip flop between sell someone for profit and then oh christ we might have a good team lets throw money at it and dig an even bigger hole. They did it again last summer spending quite big on Madsen, Varane and Celar and now back in a hole again unless Eze is sold. As I say it comes down to the owners not knowing what they want or how to achieve it
I don't want it to turn into a Les is better or Nourry is better type of conversation, they both did some good and some bad, I just look at what we are doing as a club now and what were trying to do under les and It looks the same to me with the same results
even to the point that we lost a good manager in Warbs becasue of a fall out and we're about to do the same again. Whatever side you sit on the argument if you agree with Nourry or Marti, if you agreed with Les or Warbs it doesn't really matter, the fall out is we all lose [Post edited 25 Apr 11:37]
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Fair enough. I was just responding to “nothing has changed” point. We can only really judge when a manager leaves or see where we are in 2-3 years. | | | |
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